I don't know bubba...the first one is refurbished with no accessorys....the second one has a review about the poor sound quality, which may mean it captures audio at a rediculisly low frequency right, and they are still forty buckish!
I guess the Pinnacle products are junk....but check out the reviews on this Plextor product. Maybe you can scan the web for a super deal somewhere!
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProduc...144-306&depa=0