Undenyable... Part of the commandments.

[Grimm Reaper]

Thou shall not kill.
I can't think of any real religion that condones indiscriminate killing, even for some "holy" reason. THOU SHALL NOT KILL. Take that to heart, forgive, find out what YOU can do to change what is happening, look for and DO GOOD. It is that that will do the most good, not bombs. Remember, two wrongs don't make a right.
Mike. PEACE brothers and sisters. Now is the time.
How about bombing them with RICE, or CHICKENS, and an occasional STEAK. That may do more good. God, grant us WISDOM. Amen.

[SARGE]

Only my wisdom and being wary of being kicked off the member list restrains me from writing what I truly feel. Perhaps your idea of peace would work if'n we lived in such a world; we don't. If the world had thrown rice and an occasional steak at Adolph, neither of us would have the liberty to even post in this forum. I suggest the pc crowd go find Osama and his ilk and preach the peace message to him. I can think of 7,000 reasons it won't work.

[Grimm Reaper]

even believe in peace? Do you believe in god. Do you anything outside of the military establishment? Heaven help us if there are many like you. Sorry.

[Grimm Reaper]

Woulda, been happy if...
1. he wern't insane.
2. if we threw steaks at the German people, who were very happy we saved them from communist control by bombing the german people with food. They liked that, and are still our friends cus we sent them food after the war, (even if it was SPAM). We are friends of the Germans cus we fed them after the war. We took the higher ground, and won the hearts of the Germans. (P>S> any Germans can reply here).

[mairving]

If only it were that easy. I certainly have no animosity at all towards the people of Afghanistan. They have been suffering for too many years. The problem is what do you do. It is not us that has caused these people to suffer so much. It is the murderers that they have in control of their country. Yeah we could negotiate peace with these guys so that next time they could let loose some anthrax or nerve gas and kill hundreds of thousands. It is for the good of the world that these guys are eliminated.

You are incorrect in your interpretation of Thou shalt not kill. This rule against killing was against one individual murdering another. In the same book of the Bible where this is mentioned you see:
<UL>
<LI>Exodus 21:12 - Anyone who strikes a man and kills him shall surely be put to death. <I>Killing another man is not allowed but anyone that does so should be put to death.</I>
<LI>Exodus 21:13 - However, if he does not do it intentionally, but God lets it happen, he is to flee to a place I will designate. <I> Killing in self-defense is okay.</I>
<LI>Exodus 21:18-29 - If a bull gores a man or a woman to death, the bull must be stoned to death, and its meat must not be eaten. But the owner of the bull will not be held responsible. If, however, the bull has had the habit of goring and the owner has been warned but has not kept it penned up and it kills a man or woman, the bull must be stoned and the owner also must be put to death. <I>You are responsible for your animals</I>
<LI>You also see the Israelites who were given the commandment not to kill, killing others in war. This was allowed and even sanctioned by God.
</UL>
So you can't throw out <B>Thou Shalt Not Kill</B> and say 'see there No Killing at all is allowed'. Also, please do not confuse us with the terrorists. We are not condoning indiscriminate killing. The US has shown quite considerable restraint. They certainly could have sent a boatload full of cruise missles to Afghanistan after the attack on the WTC. But the US used restraint. Instead preferring to use precision to try to remove this malignant growth to all of humanity. We have never cut off women's breasts so that their babies would die as they did in Sudan. Nor do we burn women and children and murder their fathers in front of their eyes like the Taliban does. We also give people the freedom in our country to follow the religion of their choosing. You would be killed in Afghanistan if you tried that.

To me saying we need to have peace towards the terrorists reminds me of the movie "Independence Day". The alien comes out of his coma, and the President is talking to him. He says "<I>Can there be peace among us? To which the alien replies "No peace, only die"</I> Anyway that it how it is with the terrorists. It's like saying "I know that I can live with this malignant tumor in my body if I just ignore it and don't fight it". The whole time you are doing that this tumor is looking for where to strike next. Then you die.

[Tiretool]

I believe the bible also says something to the effect of "an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth". There are several thousand eyes and teeth we need to get reimbursed for in my opinion.

The terrorists who plotted this evil deed aren't interested in peace. They were willing to kill themselves to kill thousands of innocent people. One can't just "throw meat at them". They will eat it and then use the can it came in to cut stewardesses throats on hijacked airplanes.

Sorry but you are in a world of illusion. The only way to fix the problem, is to eradicate this world of those who would follow in these Terrorists footsteps and those who would support them.

[Grimm Reaper]

to make a complex subject out of THOU SHALL NOT KILL? or are you going to make a complex subject out of simplicity itself? What is complex about PEACE brothers and Sisters?

[Grimm Reaper]

What the Germmans, Japanese, and Italians think about how we treated them after the war. Did we do the right thing? Were we helpful? Did we make a difference? Do you like us?

[mairving]

Originally posted by Grimm Reaper
to make a complex subject out of THOU SHALL NOT KILL? or are you going to make a complex subject out of simplicity itself? What is complex about PEACE brothers and Sisters?

I am not trying to make it into a complex issue. I am only trying to show that it is not credible to take the pieces that you want without taking the whole. Peace is something that we should always strive for but in this case, it would be a crime for us to try to have peace with these murderers because they will not have peace with us.

Okay, GR, we had heard the words about Peace not war but can you give us the details? How can we accomplish this? Do we apologize to the terrorists that some of their people were killed when they hijacked planes and crashed them? So please explain to us how to go about this peace.

[SARGE]

Every major city has Japanese and Italian restaurants, pizza is king and bratwurst found in nearly every store. When you ponder, "
disd we do the right thing?", what "thing" is being referenced?

BTW, this thread is straying from Contemporary Terrorism.:o

[bob]

Originally posted by Grimm Reaper
What the Germmans, Japanese, and Italians think about how we treated them after the war. Did we do the right thing? Were we helpful? Did we make a difference? Do you like us?

Great examples. We beat them to a pulp first. ;)

[WJWheels]

The truth of it is we have thrown them rice, chickens, et al.... $180 million worth so far this year to the Afgans.. and billions more to other Muslim countries around the globe. Even in this crisis, Bush has freed hudreds millions more for the relief of the Afgan refugees.

Don't believe the BS.. the terrorists don't hate us for what we've done, they hate us for what we are. They are out to destroy us by terrorist means because they KNOW our better way of life will eventually destroy them.

With the refugee situation the way it is, the sooner we take them out the better. This crap of the US killing innocents is just that. If you don't want to be killed as a terrorist protector, sympathizer, or harborer, then get the hell out of the way. Join the refugees from Afghanistan, and instead of bullets, be fed rice & chicken by the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.

[SARGE]

Bob, my semi-moderate pen-pal, has a great sense of humor (sic) :D

[Grimm Reaper]

For responce from Germans, Italians, and Japanises.

[SARGE]

Originally posted by Grimm Reaper
even believe in peace? Do you believe in god. Do you anything outside of the military establishment? Heaven help us if there are many like you. Sorry.


Believe in peace? Sure, I love it; it's the other side who disturbs it. Believe in God? None of your business when asked in this context. Ain't been in "military establishment" for years, but do things outside of it (militia meetings on week-ends, NRA member, and work in spare time). And, "Heaven should help us" if there are many like me. Actually, Heaven has helped by making many like me.

Regards...

[Stubby]

Grim Reaper, you know I've dealt with people like you when I got off the plane in LA after 11 months in Nam. And to be perfectly honest with you, people like you make me sick to my stomach!! You preach peace when 7,000 innocent Americans lay beneath tons of rubble that used to be the World Trade Center. Treat the terrorists with love you say, that will cure everything you think. Well, you tell that to the many families with children that no longer have either a mother or father because of those cowardly bastards. You said to Sarge that you hope there wasn't too many like him around, when the truth of the matter is we can only hope and pray that there aren't too many of your type around!! There is a time for love and peace, it's just that that time hasn't come yet.
I appologize if I have offended anyone by my outburst and, if need be, I will withdraw my name from the members list.

[Grimm Reaper]

you want, or enjoy, blood on your hands. Congrats, your no different than they are, Murderer.

[bob]

Originally posted by Grimm Reaper
For responce from Germans, Italians, and Japanises.

You may be waiting for a long time. Don't think there are any in this thread.

There is a nice multinational thread here:

http://community.cnn.com/cgi-bin/WebX?13@33.FF1seUrKWHQ^0@.ef0a738

They spell the same too.

[Gintaras]

Originally posted by Stubby
Grim Reaper, you know I've dealt with people like you when I got off the plane in LA after 11 months in Nam. And to be perfectly honest with you, people like you make me sick to my stomach!! You preach peace when 7,000 innocent Americans lay beneath tons of rubble that used to be the World Trade Center. Treat the terrorists with love you say, that will cure everything you think. Well, you tell that to the many families with children that no longer have either a mother or father because of those cowardly bastards. You said to Sarge that you hope there wasn't too many like him around, when the truth of the matter is we can only hope and pray that there aren't too many of your type around!! There is a time for love and peace, it's just that that time hasn't come yet.
I appologize if I have offended anyone by my outburst and, if need be, I will withdraw my name from the members list.

No problem for me with your post.
Sipmply, you just want more (see bold letters), because:

Ignorance,
Lack of Thinking,
Not knowing history( what did you do at school?),
Lack of religion(any of) knowledge,
Not seeing further than tomorrow,

[WJWheels]

Originally posted by Grimm Reaper
For responce from Germans, Italians, and Japanises. I'm a little of all of the above... well, not Japanises (whatever that is) unless you use the Yiddish adaption of J.A.P., so I'll attempt an answer. None of those countries possibly would exist, and certainly not as free democratic, industrial world powers if not for the occupation and reclamation of and by U.S. troops and dollars for a very extended period after the war. Whether they like us or not isn't really material. They have to wake up every morning and thank us for their freedom and very existance.

P.S. I don't think they dislike us enough to carry out another Pearl Harbor.

[SARGE]

Reaper, you just violated one of the major rules around here - getting personal and name-calling. "Peace" to all...


http://forum.pcmech.com/showthread.php?threadid=18163

[Gintaras]

Originally posted by Grimm Reaper
you want, or enjoy, blood on your hands. Congrats, your no different than they are, Murderer.

Keep quiter, you're dealing with "BLIND PARTIOTS".

[WJWheels]

Originally posted by Gintaras


Keep quiter, you're dealing with "BLIND PARTIOTS". By God, if I knew what language he was speaking, I'd reply to that.

I am not a "Blind Partiot"!! --- <i>blind partier maybe...</i>

[Grimm Reaper]

that's what you are. Wait till I get some answers from those that believe that the US does right, LOTS! You are "bomb them out" fools. I have less respect for you than the TALABAN. sorry. Feed them, prob goes away, guarenteed. Food is todays problem, figure it out. Mike.

[SARGE]

Wheels, I think the word is "patriot". I ain't blind, but am visually challenged; least when I'm umpiring. I think a shot was fired above, but missed...

[WJWheels]

There's a huge difference reaper. If you were speaking in opposition to the Talaban, you very well could have a bullet in the head before you could even click on "Submit Reply".

[Gintaras]

Those, who just finished watching "Rambo" movie, I'd suggest to read :
About HELL (http://www.nypost.com/news/worldnews/5434.htm).

While living in my home country- Lithuania(we had Soviet Air Base near my town), I saw coffins, I been at the grave who were in Afganistan, I knew people who were there and who were VERY lucky to get out there alive. I'm patriot of PEOPLE, not of any given country, and I don't like to have experience(seeing: coffins, WTC, etc) like I had before- believe me.

[WJWheels]

Originally posted by SARGE
Wheels, I think the word is "patriot". I ain't blind, but am visually challenged; least when I'm umpiring. I think a shot was fired above, but missed... Thanks Sarge... Well, I confess then... I am a Patriot, but I'm sure not blind. Sometimes a person's thinking is as twisted and screwed up as the words he tries to use to express it, I guess.

[Grimm Reaper]

Love thy neighbor, Peace, and goodwill toward men. You know, hate is a bad thing. Do you really hate? Christmas is coming, are you going into the season with hate on your mind? PEACE brothers and sisters. Love will get you everything, hate will get you nothing (or death).

[bob]

Could it be that Grimm Reaper is just very hungry - possible munchy attack?

[WJWheels]

Originally posted by Gintaras
Those, who just finished watching "Rambo" movie, I'd suggest to read :
About HELL (http://www.nypost.com/news/worldnews/5434.htm).

While living in my home country- Lithuania(we had Soviet Air Base near my town), I saw coffins, I been at the grave who were in Afganistan, I knew people who were there and who were VERY lucky to get out there alive. I'm patriot of PEOPLE, not of any given country, and I don't like to have experience(seeing: coffins, WTC, etc) like I had before- believe me. Well Gintaras.. If that's true then we better get those critters real soon. Osama bin Laden and his lackies have promised more of what happened on 9/11. Radical Islamic teachers have been quoted as saying they will not quit till the western world is destroyed.

[Gintaras]

Originally posted by WJWheels
Thanks Sarge... Well, I confess then... I am a Patriot, but I'm sure not blind. Sometimes a person's thinking is as twisted and screwed up as the words he tries to use to express it, I guess.

I fully agree on that.

[glc]

Sorry, folks - this thread is getting out of hand and I'm closing it. Please feel free to continue the personal attacks over at Forumclick.

My decision to close the thread is not open for discussion.

http://forum.pcmech.com/showthread.php?threadid=18163