Computer for games

[tomr]

Need some info, guys and gals. My grandson has convinced his mother that he needs a new computer to be able to play the new generation of games. Naturally he has selected a top end Dell and his mother has asked me if something less expensive might not perform satisfactorily.

So my question is, what features are most important for gaming? A 1000 MHz CPU? Will a 500 MHz do the job? How much RAM? What sort of video card? Etc, etc. Advice will be appreciated.

[Floppyman]

Hi Tom,

As it is some graphics intense games can push the cpu and videocard to their limits so having a fast cpu and videocard to run the latest games is always a good idea. What kind of games does he want to run? If it's Quake III and games like it, I'd suggest a 700-800mhz cpu and a Geforce ddr or Geforce 2 graphics card. As for ram try to get 128mb at the least for most games, more ram and they run better. Feel free to ask more questions as you have them.

[This message has been edited by Floppyman (edited 07-10-2000).]

[Tiretool]

Motherboard: Go with a tried and true motherboard instead of cutting edge stuff. A motherboard based on the Intel 440 BX chipset should serve well with no compatability issues. My personal preference = Abit BE6-II. Price: about $125

Processor: My opinion? Go with a cost effective Celeron 2 600. Good solid processor and can be overclocked if you're into that sort of thing. Price: about $110

Memory: Don't substitute here... Go for the reputable stuff. Kingston, Crucial, Mushkin, Micron, etc. Also don't skimp. 128 megs minimum. Price: about $135-$160

Video Card: This one will draw many different opinions, but here's mine... GeForce 256 DDR. Any of the following:
---WinFast GeForce 256 AGP 4x nVIDIA, 256 DDR 32MB SDRAM W/TV OUT
---Guillemot Hercules 3D Prophet 32MB DDR GeForce256 TV OUT and DVI card
---Erazor X2 DDR NVIDIA Geforce256 32mb 4X AGP with TV out
---ASUSTek V6800 PURE 3D 32MB AGP GEFORCE256/DDR
Price: about $220-$260

Sound Card: A good game deserves a good quality sound card. I recommend the Sound Blaster Live. Either the X-Gamer edition or the Value edition if money's getting tight.
Price: Sound Blaster Live X-Gamer, about $75
Sound Blaster Live Value, about $45

Modem: For all the online gaming you'll need a good gamer's modem. Tried and true and with a good pricetag, I suggest a Diamond Supra Express 56k internal. Price: about $25-$30 bucks.

Hard Drive: Seagate, Maxtor, Samsung 20 gig drive. Stay away from Western Digital.
Price: around $100-$140

CD Rom Drive: Kenwood True-X 72X CD Rom
Price: about $125

Floppy Drive: You've still gotta have one...
Any one will do.
Price: about $10-15 bucks

Monitor: I like my KDS Visual Sensations 19 inch. Price: about $250-300

Speakers: Cambridge Sound Works 4 point surround set with Subwoofer. Price: about $80

Mouse: Microsoft Intellimouse USB
Price: about $40

Keyboard: They're all the same...
Price: $20

Case: Shop around for this..... It really depends on what you want it to look like. They make clear ones, colored ones, tall ones, short ones. You get the picture... Just make sure the power supply inside it is 250 Watts as a bare minimum. Mine is 300 watts... High end systems need juice to operate. Make sure they get it!
Price: probably around $90

A rough estimate of the products I've just listed comes out to about $1505.00
Did that come close to the system you're getting from Dell? Probably not. They probably want in excess of $2000. But remember this..... their computer will more than likely come with a hefty software bundle.....

Whatever system you get, make sure it's what you want the first time. If you settle for a middle of the line system, you'll wish you had spent a little more later when everyone has bigger better systems that you...

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tiretool@pcmech.com

[This message has been edited by Tiretool (edited 07-20-2000).]

[Tiretool]

Probably one of the best "off the shelf" companies for gaming rigs, in my opinion is Alienware (http://www.alienware.com). They make high quality top end gaming computer systems for a fair price, considering the hardware they use. Plus the cases they use just look plain cool.

I don't guess you can go wrong with a major dealer like Dell. Just make sure they don't give you a motherboard with onboard sound, video, modem, etc...
Your best bet is to get a motherboard that has all seperate cards so that you can eventually upgrade when that time comes.

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tiretool@pcmech.com

[Prader Willi]

If the purpose of the computer will be mostly for gaming and you don't want to build your own-- you might consider a computer that was built specifically for gaming-- such as those built by alienware
http://www.alienware.com/

Alienwares computers always get excellent reviews-- however, I've never actually seen one

oops- didn't see Tiretool's post before I wrote this.

Another company called Falcon Northwest also makes computers with gamers in mind. http://www.falcon-nw.com/

[This message has been edited by Prader Willi (edited 07-11-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Prader Willi (edited 07-11-2000).]

[Tiretool]

Yes Falcon Northwest does make pretty solid systems. I've seen one... They are quite a bit more pricey than the Alienware systems I've seen advertised. Falcon makes premium systems with high dollar components and then tacks on a quite hefty extra amount for the "Falcon" nametag.
They do offer a cheaper "Talon" budget concious gaming rig that packs a great punch but doesn't carry that high price tag. Visit them here (http://www.falcon-nw.com/index2.html).
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tiretool@pcmech.com



[This message has been edited by Tiretool (edited 07-11-2000).]

[roverman]

Guys, great job in posting the specs. To steer away from a build your own, (i.e. time, knowledge, other reasons), what is your opinion on DELL, HP, COMPAQ, MICRON, etc. Can one of these work off the shelf?

I'll keep the specs Tiretool listed so when I am ready to build my own, I'll have better knowledge on what to look for.

thanks.

[skate2man]

What is wrong with Western Digital ???
For Hard Drives ?

[Xayd]

I'd agree with Tiretool roverman, stick with what works. Alienware does make decent machines, albeit at a hefty price. I'd stay away from the new Intel chipsets with RDRAM, since that situation gets worse and worse every day, and I personally think Rambus RAM is gonna die a slow painful death over the next year.

Really, though. If you're considering taking the big leap and putting your own machine together in the near future, why not start now? You could build this beast for about 500 bucks cheaper than you could buy it, and probably get an upgrade here and there on a couple of components for the same price.

Hell, I built my first computer with nothin' but the motherboard manual, and everything worked without a hitch. Just a matter of reading the instructions and plugging everything in. It ain't rocket science, ya know.

If you do decide to go prebuilt, though, those machines at Alienware are a good standard to go by for a gaming rig. You might take those specs to a local shop in your area and see what you can get one custom built around town for, might find a good deal. I'd get my list of components together and check the OEM prices for each part over at www.pricewatch.com. (http://www.pricewatch.com.) That way you know what your dealer is spending on parts, so you can judge the value of the whole pretty accurately.

Xayd



[This message has been edited by Xayd (edited 07-12-2000).]

[Tiretool]

Western Digital has probably one of the best service/customer satisfaction departments of any hard drive company, but the simple fact is that their drives suck. I've had two that failed within a year of buying them off the shelf. They were brand new units, not refurbs. We had a long thread in the Hardware section a couple of months back about hard drives and the general consensus was that most people had trouble with Western Digital drives.

I will give them cudos on their support staff though, and their timely return of merchandise. When I sent back my drive for a replacement the first time I had my new drive in about 2 weeks. The second time I had it back in about 3 and they sent me a bigger drive!

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tiretool@pcmech.com

[This message has been edited by Tiretool (edited 07-12-2000).]

[tomr]

Much thanks to all of you for all the good info in answer to my questions. I would love to build one for them based on the input here but they seem to be in a real hurry and will probably go with Dell. Maybe I'll build one anyway for all of the kids to use when they come to visit. http://www.pcmech.com/ubb/smile.gif

Tom

[Xayd]

Heh, be warned Tomr, that if you build and tweak your own, it's gonna outperform the one you get from Dell, so they're gonna wanna *trade* you if you do that http://www.pcmech.com/ubb/wink.gif.

Might wanna ask yourself which Dell *you* want, since the kids are gonna end up with the better of the two anyways.

Xayd

[padawan]

I would also add Quantex to the list of reputable pre-built companies. Several of my friends have them, and they are pretty good gaming systems for a fair price.
http://www.quantex.com/homepage/www.asp

[revelation]

Your grandson will be happy with the Dell if that is what is decided on. Although, you don't need the "best" thing they offer. Also, you could have them "custom" build one to some degree. Give them some of the specs that Tiretool has given, and see what they can do. They may not offer all of what was listed, but you could give and take where needed. I have owned a Dell before I started building my own. I was VERY pleased with the service. When my monitor went I called them late on a Saturday evening and Monday when I came home from work the new monitor was in the living room. I am still using the Dell monitor. Even though I have built several machines since the Dell I have not had the urge to get a better monitor. This one is great.

[Linus]

Hi,

It seems that everyone is wanting a geforce2 or the fastest CPU (1ghz etc). I have quite a few avid gamers in my university (i am not one) who believe that the fastest CPUs or the best gaming cards are meant for the next generation of games. Cards like the riva TNT2 or ATi rage fury perform quite ok with games on the market. Of course it cannot perform to the level of lets say a geforce2, but it is sufficient.
As for CPUs, a P3 600-700 will do more than necessary if you configure it properly. Example, you shutdown all programs using memory etc etc.

My friend danny runs a LAN gaming shop. He uses ATI rage fury and TNT2 cards. He also uses AMD athlon600s with 128RAM. Gamers who go there find little difference between their geforce 900+mhz systems at home and with the ones in his shop. games run are counterstrike, rogue spear, MGK2, and SWAT3.
Just follow your needs i guess. Big bucks hardware, to me are unreachable cause of my student status, but i guess we still make do. http://www.pcmech.com/ubb/smile.gif

As for the thing on the PC for your grandchild, in my opinion, a gaming machine is best built DIY. That is because you can upgrade it as and when you need it.

[Xayd]

I agree Linus.

I'm currently running a K6-2 500 with 128 megs of RAM and a slightly overclocked Voodoo 3000 AGP.

Alot of RAM and a fast video card overcome the cacheless processor, and in exchange my system costs 900 bucks instead of 1300.

I can't bog this machine down with Quake, Hexen, UT, etc. Smooth as can be.

Xayd

[padawan]

I wouldn't say that the new gear is designed exclusively for the next generation of games. Granted, there are several features that are not used in today's games (like hardware T&L), but what you really gain from running a very fast CPU with a leading edge card is the ability to play games at super high resolutions. On my Athlon 850/GeForce2 GTS box, I can play Quake3 at 1024x768x32 with all options ON, and it runs at 60+ fps. With my Celeron 700/GeForce256 SDR box, I have to lower the res, or switch a few options off.

[padawan]

Forgot to mention my comments about the original post.

Right now, the 700-800Mhz processor is the "sweet spot", where price and performance kind of intersect if you will. You'll see a big jump from about 750-800Mhz, but the performance gain doesn't justify the price difference.

My choice for a vid card right now would either be a GeForce2 MX, or the older GeForce256 DDR. With the lowly MX, you get all the advanced features of the GTS, albeit on a card about as fast as the GeForce256. With the DDR model, you get nearly the same speed as the GTS at lower resolutions, at a smaller price tag.

[Tiretool]

Good info everyone.....

I think we answered the original question in depth! LOL

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tiretool@pcmech.com

[compgenius]

A Intel Celeron 500MHz is plenty fast for gaming, put that along with *at least* 64MB RAM preferbally 128. Unless you want to spend a lot of money, a Voodoo3 3000 is good enough, you could go all out and get a GeForce 2GTS, but it costs a lot more, and personally there isn't enough of a difference to justify the money.

If you get a 500 Celeron, its going to be great for gaming, but you'll probably be being asked for another upgrade sooner than if you got a 1GHz ass-kicker.