Creating office wireless network

[dj4uk]

We are looking into the possibility of converting our current cabled network into a mainly wireless network.

All computers on the office network are connected to the internet through a single adsl line via an imac which is used as a gateway. This is probably irrelevant as it only the interconnection between the internal computers that will use the wireless connection.

Basically there are 4 areas I can see will need access points. As the building we are in is old and has thick walls the access points would basically be in line of sight with any computers within an area that need connecting (maximum 25 feet away approx.). The access points would be connected using existing ethernet cables to a hub that the gateway server and the adsl router are also connected to.

We have both PCs and Macs within our building and both would need access using the same access points. The largest area that would be served by one access point contains 9 PCs and 11 Macs.

My questions are this...
1. Does the structure of the network sound like it would work?
2. Will a single access point provide enough bandwidth for the number of computers using it (maximum approx 20)?
3. Does anyone have any recommendations for access points/adapters that can be used (remember we need the access points to work for both PCs and Macs and then possibly different adapters for the macs and pcs if needed).
4. I know there are several different standards out there at present which would you recommend?
5. What security measures should I bear in mind when installing?
6. How secure is wireless?
7. Would we need additional software to set this up with macs and pcs - at present the network is purely tcp/ip so although the macs can't "see" the pcs and vice versa we can all connect to the internet - ideally though we would be able to "see" all the computers.

Answers to some/all the questions and any additional advice would be appreciates. Any suggestions of rough prices would be good too.

Cheers

DJ

[mbossman2]

Originally posted by dj4uk
We are looking into the possibility of converting our current cabled network into a mainly wireless network.

All computers on the office network are connected to the internet through a single adsl line via an imac which is used as a gateway. This is probably irrelevant as it only the interconnection between the internal computers that will use the wireless connection.

Basically there are 4 areas I can see will need access points. As the building we are in is old and has thick walls the access points would basically be in line of sight with any computers within an area that need connecting (maximum 25 feet away approx.). The access points would be connected using existing ethernet cables to a hub that the gateway server and the adsl router are also connected to.

We have both PCs and Macs within our building and both would need access using the same access points. The largest area that would be served by one access point contains 9 PCs and 11 Macs.

My questions are this...
1. Does the structure of the network sound like it would work?
2. Will a single access point provide enough bandwidth for the number of computers using it (maximum approx 20)?
3. Does anyone have any recommendations for access points/adapters that can be used (remember we need the access points to work for both PCs and Macs and then possibly different adapters for the macs and pcs if needed).
4. I know there are several different standards out there at present which would you recommend?
5. What security measures should I bear in mind when installing?
6. How secure is wireless?
7. Would we need additional software to set this up with macs and pcs - at present the network is purely tcp/ip so although the macs can't "see" the pcs and vice versa we can all connect to the internet - ideally though we would be able to "see" all the computers.

Answers to some/all the questions and any additional advice would be appreciates. Any suggestions of rough prices would be good too.

Cheers

DJ

#1 - sounds good, but please remember that wireless is really an extension of a wired network, not a replacement for wired. the overall performance of a wireless network is substantially less than an equivalent wired, switched network. Wireless is a "shared" technology and access points act like hubs, not switches. As long as you understand this and are willing to sacrifice the performance than you are ok. In addtion, your access points should all roll back to a central switch (as opposed to a hub)

#2 - most access points can physically handle up to 1024 users, but in reality 30-75 users are the max for commerical grade equipment before they become overly congested.

#3 - in a mixed environment (PC's and Mac's), i know of only 1 company that provides both drivers with their product and that is Cisco. You can go with 1 vendor for the PC's and another for the Macs, but the support on this, especially if you grow, will become an issue.

#4 - Wireless standards: my advice to my customers is to go 11b or 11g. they are interoperable with each other and the majority of the installs out there 11b and if you travel alot you will run into far more 11b installs than 11a installs. you don't want to have to carry around 2 cards, 1 for the office and 1 for travel.

#5 & 6 wireless networks extend out beyond the walls (no matter how thick) of your office and security should be of paramount concern (according to the Gartner group, it is the #1 concern of Fortune 500 CTO's when it comes to their networks). Basic WEP security is OK (at best), but you will want to shop around for the best security that your budget can handle. Again, in this area, Cisco leads the pack.

#7 - i'll let one of the Mac gurus (lawyerron is running a mixed environment I believe) answer your question.

[dj4uk]

mbossman2 thanks for all your advice!

#1. Yep the main network would still be wired as you say so the wireless access points are simply extensions. At present as we are a small company we do not have any switches only hubs so using access points should not be a problem (there are 40 max computers in the whole building). Do you think this would need amending if we went wireless? i.e. the hub that all the access points link into should be a switch instead. Would we see a large performance improvement?

#2 Thats good news.

#3 If I got access points that conform to the 11g standard would it be ok to have different adapters for the macs and pcs? i.e. If the adapter works with the computer (say actiontec for pc and apple for mac) and uses the same standard as the access point (11g) then would they both be able to use the same access point (example actiontec). This might be cheaper for us.

#4 I was thinking of going for the 11g standard for the access points as we have a couple of computers with 11b adapters and I know 11g is backwards compatible. Plus 11g gives greater bandwidth if I'm correct? (54Mbits/s) Thing is I've heard that the 11g standard hasn't been formalized so does this mean some 11g devices won't necessarily work together?

#5 & #6 We would definately have WEP security setup as this is very easy to do but what additional security measures could we take to make sure our network is fairly secure. The information on the network is generally not senstive however on occasion we have information that is embargoed before a client release so this would obviously need to be secure to a certain degree. Are the additional security measures you are talking about within thw wireless setup or the general setup of the network?

#7 I hope he takes look at this thread then!

Thanks again for your suggestions so far - everything is alot clearer in my mind.

DJ

[mbossman2]

Originally posted by dj4uk
mbossman2 thanks for all your advice!

#1. Yep the main network would still be wired as you say so the wireless access points are simply extensions. At present as we are a small company we do not have any switches only hubs so using access points should not be a problem (there are 40 max computers in the whole building). Do you think this would need amending if we went wireless? i.e. the hub that all the access points link into should be a switch instead. Would we see a large performance improvement?

#2 Thats good news.

#3 If I got access points that conform to the 11g standard would it be ok to have different adapters for the macs and pcs? i.e. If the adapter works with the computer (say actiontec for pc and apple for mac) and uses the same standard as the access point (11g) then would they both be able to use the same access point (example actiontec). This might be cheaper for us.

#4 I was thinking of going for the 11g standard for the access points as we have a couple of computers with 11b adapters and I know 11g is backwards compatible. Plus 11g gives greater bandwidth if I'm correct? (54Mbits/s) Thing is I've heard that the 11g standard hasn't been formalized so does this mean some 11g devices won't necessarily work together?

#5 & #6 We would definately have WEP security setup as this is very easy to do but what additional security measures could we take to make sure our network is fairly secure. The information on the network is generally not senstive however on occasion we have information that is embargoed before a client release so this would obviously need to be secure to a certain degree. Are the additional security measures you are talking about within thw wireless setup or the general setup of the network?

#7 I hope he takes look at this thread then!

Thanks again for your suggestions so far - everything is alot clearer in my mind.

DJ

#1 - i am a huge fan of switches (as are most networking folks) - the performance gain, especially on a largish small(?) and mid sized networks, is pretty substantial. Good rule of thumb: consistent network utilization of 30% (you'll need to have a sniffer on the network to determine this or some managed hubs) or higher is a milestone on the road leading to "its time for switches-ville"

#3 - you can mix different vendor's NICs and AP's but there are some trade offs: 1) IS support - each wireless client softwaer/driver is different so you will have to learn the differences of dealing with them. in the long run, it is much easier (and provides a better total cost of ownership [TCO]) to standardize on one vendor(and don't forget vendor support, vendors love to blame the other guy for problems, give 'em a chance adn they will). 2) Better performance - when you match cards to access points, the overall performance is better than having a mishmash of vendors. 3) security - some of the advanced security products available for wireless (like Cisco's LEAP http://www.cisco.com/en/US/netsol/ns110/ns175/ns176/ns178/netbr09186a0080088829.html) are very dependant on NIC card and access point support.

#4 - 11g has been standardized but interoperability is always a concern until proven otherwise. while companies do adhere to the standard sometimes issues do crop up. I can see no reason why you shouldn't mix 11b and 11g in the same network.

#'s 5&6 - check the link I embedded above as well as this: http://www.cisco.com/application/pdf/en/us/guest/netsol/ns314/c654/ccmigration_09186a008009c8b3.pdf . these will give you more information than you could ever possibly want on wireless network security.

#7 - send ron a PM and ask him to look in on this thread.

best of luck

[mbossman2]

Originally posted by mbossman2
#1 - i am a huge fan of switches (as are most networking folks) - the performance gain, especially on a largish small(?) and mid sized networks, is pretty substantial. Good rule of thumb: consistent network utilization of 30% (you'll need to have a sniffer on the network to determine this or some managed hubs) or higher is a milestone on the road leading to "its time for switches-ville"

#3 - you can mix different vendor's NICs and AP's but there are some trade offs: 1) IS support - each wireless client softwaer/driver is different so you will have to learn the differences of dealing with them. in the long run, it is much easier (and provides a better total cost of ownership [TCO]) to standardize on one vendor(and don't forget vendor support, vendors love to blame the other guy for problems, give 'em a chance adn they will). 2) Better performance - when you match cards to access points, the overall performance is better than having a mishmash of vendors. 3) security - some of the advanced security products available for wireless (like Cisco's LEAP http://www.cisco.com/en/US/netsol/ns110/ns175/ns176/ns178/netbr09186a0080088829.html) are very dependant on NIC card and access point support. I know that apple supports Cisco LEAP, but I am not sure of Actiontec

#4 - 11g has been standardized but interoperability is always a concern until proven otherwise. while companies do adhere to the standard sometimes issues do crop up. I can see no reason why you shouldn't mix 11b and 11g in the same network.

#'s 5&6 - check the link I embedded above as well as this: http://www.cisco.com/application/pdf/en/us/guest/netsol/ns314/c654/ccmigration_09186a008009c8b3.pdf . these will give you more information than you could ever possibly want on wireless network security.

#7 - send ron a PM and ask him to look in on this thread.

best of luck

[dj4uk]

Thanks for all your help - I'll take a look at the links when I have a free minute.