Stuck between 2 choices.

[KrishKrash]

Hello, I need help on deciding what I should do. I'm trying to get a computer that can play WoW (World Of Warcraft) on maximum video quality. I'm getting some money pretty soon and I'm stuck between 2 choices.

1.Buy new parts from a local computer store and build a computer from scratch.
- I don't know the first thing on how to assemble a computer, I fear I would break a part or ruin something or get parts that aren't compatible.

2.Check out some computers at the store do some research and see if they're customizable.
- I would like to be able to throw in a AGP or PCI-X video card,new sound card and more ram. However I would need to find a computer that you can do this with. I know my friend has an old dell however he has a awesome sound card and a 7800AGP geforce in it. I'm also cautious about this because the all the new computers come with Vista and I don't want Vista yet. This brings me back to the idea of building a computer so I could have XP but I don't want to for the reasons I listed above.

Buying parts online is not a option for me right now. I would like to know if you guys had any experience with computers like HP,eMachines,Dell's,Gateway's etc. Do you know which ones I should avoid? I'm really considering a dell right now cause most dell's seem to be open for improvement/upgrades. Also, is there a way I could check if a computer has a AGP or PCI-X slot without opening it? If I were to go along with option 2 I could check inside however that would void my warranty and refund so if it doesn't have either I'm screwed. My budget for a computer is $1000-1500 which is more than enough for most computers I see on shelves at the local store. Can anyone help?

[minsonngo]

Avoid eMachines. DELL is good in my book... but they are not good for gaming usually.


The best choice would be to build your own. It isn' too hard.

Read this guide here: http://www.pcmech.com/show/build/282/

and people can help you with any questions you may have on this forum.

[KrishKrash]

Originally Posted by minsonngo Avoid eMachines. DELL is good in my book... but they are not good for gaming usually. The best choice would be to build your own. It isn' too hard. Read this guide here: http://www.pcmech.com/show/build/282/ and people can help you with any questions you may have on this forum.

Alright, tomorrow I'm going to see if I can head over to the computer store and see what they have for offer.

[maxnik]

i think if I were buying - I'd go with Dell

[KrishKrash]

Alright I went there my first priority was to find a case. I saw a couple but I don't know what would be a good one to get. I've seen people say stuff like ATX and things like that but I don't understand. Is there a certain type of good case to get? I'm being hypothetical here but lets say ATX-1 is bad, you should buy ATX-2 or whatever. Does the case depend on the size of the parts you put in? Or it doesn't matter?

[billstur]

Originally Posted by KrishKrash Alright I went there my first priority was to find a case. I saw a couple but I don't know what would be a good one to get. I've seen people say stuff like ATX and things like that but I don't understand. Is there a certain type of good case to get? I'm being hypothetical here but lets say ATX-1 is bad, you should buy ATX-2 or whatever. Does the case depend on the size of the parts you put in? Or it doesn't matter?

To begin with - what's your budget?

As far as the case goes, I like Cooler Master. I built another system for a hard core gamer, using a Thermaltake case. It was nice. A full or mid tower ATX case should have plenty of room for any thing you might want to do.

If your budget is low, and you want a computer pre-built, I'd suggest HP. If your budget is unlimited, check out Alienware (online).

Here is one that all the PC-Mecher's helped me put together. If this fits in your budget, it could be a starting point.

Motherboard
ASUS M2N-SLI Deluxe Socket AM2 NVIDIA nForce 570 SLI MCP ATX AMD Motherboard - Retail - $139.99

CPU
MD Athlon 64 X2 6000+ Windsor 3.0GHz Socket AM2 Processor Model ADX6000CZBOX - Retail - $229.00

Memory
(2) CORSAIR XMS2 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) - $232.00

Video Card
EVGA 320-P2-N815-AR GeForce 8800GTS 320MB 320-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 HDCP Video Card - Retail - $299.99

Audio Card
Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi XtremeGamer 7.1 Channels 24-bit 96KHz PCI Interface Sound Card - Retail - $89.99

Hard Drive
Western Digital Raptor X WD1500AHFD 150GB 10,000 RPM 16MB Cache Serial ATA150 Hard Drive - OEM - $204.99

Hard Drives
(2) Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3320620AS (Perpendicular Recording Technology) 320GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM - $159.98

External Hard Drive Enclosure
ICY DOCK MB559US-1S-B Aluminum body with partial plastic 3.5" USB 2.0 & eSATA External Enclosure - Retail - $59.99

DVD ROM
ASUS Black 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-ROM SATA DVD-ROM Drive Model DVD-E616A3T - Retail - $21.99

DVD Burner
Sony NEC Optiarc Black 18X - $32.99

Case
COOLER MASTER CAVALIER 3 CAV-T03-UK Black Aluminum / Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail - $64.99

Power Supply
CORSAIR CMPSU-520HX ATX12V v2.2 and EPS12V 2.91 520W Power Supply - $129.95

Software
Microsoft Windows Vista 64-Bit Home Premium for System Builders Single Pack DVD - OEM - $119.99

Total - Around $1750.00

[Windu]

I would build. I built a much better computer than you could buy friom dell, as does most who build. Very upgradeable, and fast also. It was very easy. All of the parts just went together. My first build as well. Coolermaster makes some very good cases for around 60 bucks.
My build was,
5600+
M2N32-SLI Delux MB
2 gb corsair ram
BFG 640 mb video card
320 seagate hard drive.
cost around $1000

I'd suggest a 5600+ or a 6600 and go from there.
Good luck.

[jer888]

I know you said you can't buy online but I would really recommend you try to find a way to. This is just a list to use if you find a way to. Newegg.com has a greater selection of parts, good prices, and excellent customer service. I would recommend you shop there. Intel's Core 2 Duo's are outpreforming AMD's chips for less money right now. Heres a list of parts:

CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 Conroe 2.4GHz 4M shared L2 Cache LGA 775 Processor - Retail=
$223.90
Free 3 Business Day Shipping
(Not available in HI, AK and PR)
In Stock

MOTHERBOARD: ASUS P5B LGA 775 Intel P965 Express ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail =
$116.99
3 Business Day Shipping $6.13
(Not available in HI, AK and PR)
In Stock

RAM: CORSAIR ValueSelect 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 667 (PC2 5300) Desktop Memory - Retail =
$64.99
3 Business Day Shipping $4.99
(Not available in HI, AK and PR)
In Stock

Hard drive depends on how much space you need, but this has the best GB/$ ratio and a 5 year warranty.
HARD DRIVE: Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3320620AS (Perpendicular Recording Technology) 320GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM =
$79.99
Free 3 Business Day Shipping
(Not available in HI, AK and PR)
In Stock

POWER SUPPLY: CORSAIR CMPSU-520HX ATX12V v2.2 and EPS12V 2.91 520W Power Supply 100 - 240 V UL, CUL, CE, CB, FCC Class B, TUV, CCC, C-tick - Retail = Original Price: $139.99
You Save: $10.00
$129.99
($119.99 after $10.00 Mail-In Rebate)
Free 3 Business Day Shipping
(Not available in HI, AK and PR)
In Stock

VIDEO CARD: EVGA 640-P2-N821-AR GeForce 8800GTS 640MB 320-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 HDCP Video Card - Retail =
$379.99
($349.99 after $30.00 Mail-In Rebate)
3 Business Day Shipping $6.13
(Not available in HI, AK and PR)
In Stock

OPTICAL: LITE-ON Black 20X DVD+R 8X DVD+RW 8X DVD+R DL 20X DVD-R 6X DVD-RW 12X DVD-RAM 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-R 32X CD-RW 48X CD-ROM 2MB Cache SATA DVD Burner - Retail =
$34.99
3 Business Day Shipping $6.13
(Not available in HI, AK and PR)
In Stock

You still need a case to put all this stuff in. You didn't say if you needed a moniter, keyboard, mouse, and speakers, but make sure you have all that.

[KrishKrash]

Alright, sorry for not responding for awhile. I've been very busy and I managed to obtain a way to order a computer from the internet. I've "built" a computer on dell.com and I'm very pleased with it, tell me what you guys think.

Dell Dimension E521
Operating System- Genuine Windows Vista™ Home Premium
Memory- 2GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 667MHz- 2DIMMs
Video Card- 256MB ATI Radeon X1300 Pro
CPU- AMD Athlon™ 64 X2 Dual-Core 4400+
soundcard- Integrated Sound Blaster®Audigy™ HD Software Edition
Speakers- Dell A525 30 Watt 2.1 Stereo Speakers with Subwoofer
Monitor- 19 inch SE198WFP Widescreen Flat Panel Monitor
I'll most likely be ordering this tomorrow, I feel this is more than enough for what I want it to do. I'll be able to upgrade it too if it ever fails me or needs a tune up.
All this and a few other things for right under $1000.

[Stuey]

Originally Posted by KrishKrash Alright, sorry for not responding for awhile. I've been very busy and I managed to obtain a way to order a computer from the internet. I've "built" a computer on dell.com and I'm very pleased with it, tell me what you guys think. Dell Dimension E521 Operating System- Genuine Windows Vista™ Home Premium Memory- 2GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 667MHz- 2DIMMs Video Card- 256MB ATI Radeon X1300 Pro CPU- AMD Athlon™ 64 X2 Dual-Core 4400+ soundcard- Integrated Sound Blaster®Audigy™ HD Software Edition Speakers- Dell A525 30 Watt 2.1 Stereo Speakers with Subwoofer Monitor- 19 inch SE198WFP Widescreen Flat Panel Monitor I'll most likely be ordering this tomorrow, I feel this is more than enough for what I want it to do. I'll be able to upgrade it too if it ever fails me or needs a tune up. All this and a few other things for right under $1000.

X1300 is garbage. It can handle WoW but will be underpowered for most of the eye candy. You might be able to upgrade it, but people sometimes have issues with the Dell PSU not being able to handle the new power requirements after an upgrade.

Also, I'm wary of Dell's speaker offerings. You're better off heading to Circuit City or other large local retailer and hearing a set of Logitechs or Creatives and then buying what sounds decent. Both companies have affordable offerings. This is just my two cents though.

Also, check http://www.xpbargains.com/dell_coupons for Dell discount coupons.

[whitedragon]

well this is just my thoughts on dell they used to be good but now they are not iv had 3 dell's all broke in a month same with a mate's. And as for the OS you wont get the dvd rom so if you ever have to reformat you will have to buy vista.But as i have said thats just my thoughts on them. If i had been you i would have gone alienwear

[whubbard]

Try to find somebody who can order from newegg for you, and then you can pay them however you would pay the store.

The way that you are going to get a good PC for $1000...is building. otherwise I doubt you will be able to buy anything that will let you play on max.

[Stuey]

It used to be that you could pay $10 for the OS disc. Now, supposedly you can ask for it after you order your system and they'll send it to you. I can't guarantee this though - I only recently read it and it was on these forums so there's a chance it's inaccurate.

[KrishKrash]

Originally Posted by Stuey X1300 is garbage. It can handle WoW but will be underpowered for most of the eye candy. You might be able to upgrade it, but people sometimes have issues with the Dell PSU not being able to handle the new power requirements after an upgrade. Also, I'm wary of Dell's speaker offerings. You're better off heading to Circuit City or other large local retailer and hearing a set of Logitechs or Creatives and then buying what sounds decent. Both companies have affordable offerings. This is just my two cents though. Also, check http://www.xpbargains.com/dell_coupons for Dell discount coupons.

I've checked reviews on 3 different types on X1300's on newegg (The only 1300's they had on the list) and I got a bunch of different opinions.

A bunch of people love it, says it runs fear,oblivion,wow,HL2,CS:S and such on medium-high or max(with HL2,Wow,CS:S) with no problems. Then I got people saying it sucks, can't run anything on good settings with decent framerates and it doesn't work with Dell's. I don't get it, if it didn't work with Dell's why would it be under the option of (2) video cards you can chose to have in it? Wouldn't they have realized "hey it doesn't work with dell's best if we take this off the list" It's also very confusing having a bunch of people saying they love it then a bunch saying they hate it. Is their a way I could get a new PSU if the one that comes with the Dell is bad? Or isn't good enough for an upgrade?(IF needed)

[Gen.Ben]

Originally Posted by KrishKrash I've checked reviews on 3 different types on X1300's on newegg (The only 1300's they had on the list) and I got a bunch of different opinions. A bunch of people love it, says it runs fear,oblivion,wow,HL2,CS:S and such on medium-high or max(with HL2,Wow,CS:S) with no problems. Then I got people saying it sucks, can't run anything on good settings with decent framerates and it doesn't work with Dell's. I don't get it, if it didn't work with Dell's why would it be under the option of (2) video cards you can chose to have in it? Wouldn't they have realized "hey it doesn't work with dell's best if we take this off the list" It's also very confusing having a bunch of people saying they love it then a bunch saying they hate it. Is their a way I could get a new PSU if the one that comes with the Dell is bad? Or isn't good enough for an upgrade?(IF needed)

I have the E520, basically the same thing as your PC just with an Intel processor. The x1300 Pro runs CS:S at high settings (HDR off) 1440x900 resolution @ about 100fps.

The x1300 Pro will run Warcraft fine. You might have to dumb the settings down a tad though.

Also, Dell gives you more options of video cards when you chose the Advanced PC category.
If you do play on getting a new video card, you will most likely have to buy a new PSU.

I reccomend anything from Antec or thermaltake over 400 watts.

[KrishKrash]

Originally Posted by Gen.Ben I have the E520, basically the same thing as your PC just with an Intel processor. The x1300 Pro runs CS:S at high settings (HDR off) 1440x900 resolution @ about 100fps. The x1300 Pro will run Warcraft fine. You might have to dumb the settings down a tad though. Also, Dell gives you more options of video cards when you chose the Advanced PC category. If you do play on getting a new video card, you will most likely have to buy a new PSU. I reccomend anything from Antec or thermaltake over 400 watts.

I can't find that advanced PC category, could you tell me how to find it?

[Stuey]

Originally Posted by KrishKrash I can't find that advanced PC category, could you tell me how to find it?

I think that he's referring to Dell's "XPS" line.
http://www.dell.com/content/products...ory.aspx/xpsdt

I'm sure that the x1300 would be sufficient for the time being for some games, but you might not be able to enable the advanced eye candy, and might need to limit your resolution. Also, instead of spending the money on an upgrade video card and PSU for a new build, just build/configure it as you like it the first time around.

What some people did was buy the card off of Newegg or elsewhere and try to install it into a low-end Dell or something similar. They either had compatibility issues or power supply inadequacies. People sometimes don't do their research before they buy. You have to take Newegg reviews with a grain of salt.

[SoldierOfTheCross]

A lot of the reviews you read on newegg are from people who do not know what they're doing. They either install it wrong and it didn't work or they installed something else wrong and screwed up the product they're reviewing or they didn't configure it right. And some people are just plain picky. Nothing is perfect, there will always be components that go bad, as long as there aren't a bunch of DOA or major failure reviews I wouldn't worry.

Dell makes decent computers, especially if all you're playing is WoW. You can upgrade your GC later on as well as your PSU if you wish. I can run Battlefield 1942 at max settings on my stock Dell Dimension 4700, I can only imagine how WoW will run on something twice as good as that. If your budget is $1,000 - $1,500 why not go with the XPS system, they're more in the line of a gaming computer and you can probably get a better GC in it. Also, Vista, I wouldn't do that, if they're still offering XP Home or Pro go with that. My cousin has Vista and he is unable to play any games on it, whether or not it's just a bad version or something else, Vista has a lot of bugs still. Plus, if you ever need to wipe the HDD getting a new XP disc is much cheaper.

You could also build your own. You will have to invest more time into it as well as a little more money then a pre-built but in the end you get exactly what you want and none of the useless junk that usually ends up in the cheaper pre-builts. You also learn a lot about a computer when building it yourself, I'd do it just for the experience. You may run into a problem building your own if you can't (or don't want to) order anything online. If you're getting everything from a local computer store your options are greatly reduced to what the store has in stock. I strongly suggest that if you're going to build your own you get it online. newegg is the best and their customer service is top notch.

[jer888]

Originally Posted by whitedragon well this is just my thoughts on dell they used to be good but now they are not iv had 3 dell's all broke in a month same with a mate's. And as for the OS you wont get the dvd rom so if you ever have to reformat you will have to buy vista.But as i have said thats just my thoughts on them. If i had been you i would have gone alienwear

Dells owns Alienware and Alienware is wayyy overpriced anyway.

[whitedragon]

do u mean Dells are better or that they own them ??? . And yes alien's are over priced i admit

[jer888]

Originally Posted by whitedragon do u mean Dells are better or that they own them ??? . And yes alien's are over priced i admit

Dell bought Aleinware.

[whitedragon]

Nooooo dell is takeing over the world

[Unforseen]

I had a HP Pavillion a couple years ago that I stuck a new video card into. I had also bought a PSU to go with it because the original was going to be strained by the new video card. Anyway, I went to go stick in the PSU and it wouldn't fit in the case. The PSU they used wasn't standard ATX. So I then bought a new case and tried to move over all the components to that case. When trying to install the motherboard I realized the the holes didn't line up. Moral of the story: Most brand name companies (i.e. dell, hp, gateway) make proprietary components that make it difficult for you to upgrade.

[jer888]

Originally Posted by Unforseen I had a HP Pavillion a couple years ago that I stuck a new video card into. I had also bought a PSU to go with it because the original was going to be strained by the new video card. Anyway, I went to go stick in the PSU and it wouldn't fit in the case. The PSU they used wasn't standard ATX. So I then bought a new case and tried to move over all the components to that case. When trying to install the motherboard I realized the the holes didn't line up. Moral of the story: Most brand name companies (i.e. dell, hp, gateway) make proprietary components that make it difficult for you to upgrade.

Yeah exactly, so you'll pay them 400 dollars to put in a 200 dollar video card or so you buy a whole new computer entirely. Thank god for DIY.

[whubbard]

Originally Posted by Unforseen When trying to install the motherboard I realized the the holes didn't line up.

powerdrill time...just don't slip...

But to the OP:
I would really try and find a local store and build this yourself...even if you can't order online.

[Stuey]

Originally Posted by whubbard powerdrill time...just don't slip... But to the OP: I would really try and find a local store and build this yourself...even if you can't order online.

no no no powerdrill time! He'd have to make new holes in the mobo tray NOT the mobo itself, and then would have to tap each one or find non-threaded mobo standoffs.

Unless he's really lucky, there's a high probability that selection will be limited and only a few older components will be available and at greatly inflated costs.

But also, if he cannot order online, then he'll have difficulties getting a customized Dell.

[whubbard]

Originally Posted by Stuey no no no powerdrill time! He'd have to make new holes in the mobo tray NOT the mobo itself, and then would have to tap each one or find non-threaded mobo standoffs.

nah, all you would have to do mark where to drill on the mobo tray, and drill with a bit that is a bit smaller that the diamater of the screw. I have done this many times with sheet metal and screws (never with a mobo and tray...but its basically the same thing).

Originally Posted by Stuey Unless he's really lucky, there's a high probability that selection will be limited and only a few older components will be available and at greatly inflated costs. But also, if he cannot order online, then he'll have difficulties getting a customized Dell.

I can't imagine the costs would be too infated. Atleast not to more that what he could get a dell for...otherwise the store would be bankrupt. So he might be only able to build a system a little bit better than the dell...but atleast he can get what he wants.

[Stuey]

Small local computer shops typically make their money in repairs, service, and possibly custom builds. They stay in business because when someone's computer goes down they'll naively pay $250 for a small capacity HD and OS reinstall.

Also, I think I was mistaken. I thought that you were advocating drilling into the motherboard to create new holes - lol.

[whubbard]

Originally Posted by Stuey Small local computer shops typically make their money in repairs, service, and possibly custom builds. They stay in business because when someone's computer goes down they'll naively pay $250 for a small capacity HD and OS reinstall.

True...but its possible that he could request that the store (through their distributors) obtain certain parts...and then he would pay them a bit of a premium...i bet they would gladly do this.

Originally Posted by Stuey Also, I think I was mistaken. I thought that you were advocating drilling into the motherboard to create new holes - lol.

yeah, umm, drilling into the motherboard...not a great idea

[KrishKrash]

Alright I've changed my mind and went with a new one. This is totally overkill right?

XPS 410----- Intel® Core™ 2 Duo Processor E4300 (2MB L2 Cache,1.8GHz,800FSB)
Operating System----- Genuine Windows® XP Home Edition with re-installation CD
Memory------ 2GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 667MHz - 2 DIMMs
Monitor------ 19 inch SE198WFP Widescreen Flat Panel Monitor
Video Card -----256MB nVidia GeForce 8600 GTS
Hard Drive ------250GB Serial ATA 3Gb/s Hard Drive (7200RPM) w/DataBurst Cache™
CD or DVD Drive------ Single Drive: 16X CD/DVD burner (DVD+/-RW) w/double layer write capability
Sound Cards ------Integrated 7.1 Channel Audio
Speakers------ Dell WL6000 5.8GHz Wireless Rear 5.1 Speaker System with Subwoofer