audiophile rig

[Blaster3]

looking for advice/info:
i am lookin to build from the ground up, that means i need everything including a case.

sole purpose: to record, store, rip/burn, & listen to audio files; mostly rock, blues, jazz, alternative. possibly to watch dvd's also.
a lot of my cd collection are SACD, DVD Audio, SACD hybryds, although i have many 'normal' cd's.

target budget: $1100 total including monitor & speakers
time frame: not in a hurry, might take me couple months to decide on components & order them

i would prefer recommendations that would include motherboard, cpu/processors, audio cards that are compatible with each other, along with software that 'plays nice' with those components. butt all advice is welcome, along with any personal experiences with particular software/hardware.
BTW; i'm a computer novice with little experience, although i've updated some components in my ole dell seen in sig. i'm also partial to XP Pro, butt willing to change if you convince me.

i would like to start out with 2 optical drives, butt need room to add up to at least 1 more.
multiple HDD bays are required, possibly 3 to 5 or more, butt i'm willing to start with just 1 installed to remain on budget, got lots of cd's to store (1303 at last count & growing).

i will not need a modem, i'm broadband cable here, so just need an ethernet connection.
i do not plan on installing any other hardware other than whats needed for audio/video, ie: floppy drive, or zip drive unless you feel its absolutely necessary.

hope i've explained myself clearly
any other info you need?

thanks, this will be a work in progress for quite some time

[mwulf85]

Are you really going to be using only the speakers attached to this PC to listen to your music or to you plan on connecting it to an external DAC and then to a set of speakers? If you already have any kind of stereo system, I would strongly recommend you included that into your design model…

[jdeb]

looks like he has got a nice little system already. What is wrong with what is in his signature? Just curious. Maybe a sound card and some sound deadening material?

http://www.directron.com/audiophle192.html

[quartet-man]

Originally Posted by jdeb looks like he has got a nice little system already. What is wrong with what is in his signature? Just curious. Maybe a sound card and some sound deadening material? http://www.directron.com/audiophle192.html

That and some huge hard drives.

[mwulf85]

Originally Posted by jdeb looks like he has got a nice little system already. What is wrong with what is in his signature? Just curious. Maybe a sound card and some sound deadening material? http://www.directron.com/audiophle192.html

Well, we always want something better now don’t we…

But I agree with general point of your post, a music PC does not really have steep hardware requirements…not like a top-notch gaming, video editing or autocad machine….drive space being one the biggest, depending on the size and file type of the library in question….

[XenaWP]

2 observations. Most run-of-the-mill optical drives don't test well for secure rips. Media Jukebox can test them and its results were that neither of mine were terribly good (Asus DVD-ROM and Samsung DVD-RW). I believe Plextor has a very good rep, if you can find one.

Onboard HD audio sounds surprisingly good through speakers and surprisingly bad through good earphones. So depending on your playback choice, you may or may not need a top of the line audio card.

[jdeb]

Originally Posted by quartet-man That and some huge hard drives.

i understand and thanks for your insight...

so I was wondering why he was feeling he needed a new system, add a nice
audiophile would be a requirement of a new system anyway.

I assume the hard drive (s) would be a recommendation based on his needs or a problem? So your saying capacity is the deal with his system? He alluded to this but was not clear in my mind. I also assume in his post that he has an advanced knowledge of working around media constrictions based on his current hardware... I was not going to address this unless I had a clear understanding of his expectations. I trust that his situation could be a finite situation and a direct correlation in regards to artistic expression, and I would be not want to be the person that takes something away from him.

I also assume external sound (of a PC) could be an issue for him with his current system. I was looking or probing for ways to help him save money with his current "GREAT" hardware and tailor to his needs. He obviously has a great deal of knowledge in terms of hardware (in my opinion) and some people (myself) may not have a true understanding of what he is asking.

I trust he is looking for a 3000 retail system for 1100 and he or she thinks that 1100 is going to build him or her a Onkyo APX 2 system.

The challenge to me is to help him or her do it.

[quartet-man]

Originally Posted by jdeb i understand and thanks for your insight... so I was wondering why he was feeling he needed a new system, add a nice audiophile would be a requirement of a new system anyway. I assume the hard drive (s) would be a recommendation based on his needs or a problem? So your saying capacity is the deal with his system? He alluded to this but was not clear in my mind. I also assume in his post that he has an advanced knowledge of working around media constrictions based on his current hardware... I was not going to address this unless I had a clear understanding of his expectations. I trust that his situation could be a finite situation and a direct correlation in regards to artistic expression, and I would be not want to be the person that takes something away from him. I also assume external sound (of a PC) could be an issue for him with his current system. I was looking or probing for ways to help him save money with his current "GREAT" hardware and tailor to his needs. He obviously has a great deal of knowledge in terms of hardware (in my opinion) and some people (myself) may not have a true understanding of what he is asking. I trust he is looking for a 3000 retail system for 1100 and he or she thinks that 1100 is going to build him or her a Onkyo APX 2 system. The challenge to me is to help him or her do it.

On one of his posts he made the comment about having a lot of music and I either read or for some reason assumed that he saved them as Wav files as I do. The hard drive he had didn't seem all that big for a huge collection, but I have a lot more than he does even though many are not on hard drives yet.

[jdeb]

Originally Posted by quartet-man On one of his posts he made the comment about having a lot of music and I either read or for some reason assumed that he saved them as Wav files as I do. The hard drive he had didn't seem all that big for a huge collection, but I have a lot more than he does even though many are not on hard drives yet.

right on

i wish they would respond, we could hook them up

[Blaster3]

oops... forgot to post my build list... here it goes:


Antec Performance One P180 Silver cold rolled steel ATX Mid Tower case $129.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811129154

Asus P5Q Premium LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard $219.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813131326

kingston HyperX ddr2 1066 4g (2 x 2g) dual channel kit $64.99/each total: $129.98
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820104098

Pioneer 20x SATA DVD Burner Model DVR-2910 (2 each) $44.99/each total: $89.98
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16827129026

cooling fans
http://www.silenx.com/ixtremaprofans.asp?sku=ixp-13-14

CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX 750W ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Power Supply $124.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817139006

WD 1T 32mb sata 3.0 Hard Drive (3 each) $129.99/each total: $389.97
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16822136284

Itel Core 2 Quad Q6600 Processor $196.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819115017

Asus VH226H 2ms HDMI widescreen 1080p monitor $189.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16824236051

Klipsch groove pm20 speakers $119.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16836119009

M-AUDIO 2496 sound card $99.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16829121120

WISH LIST:
Dynaudio MC 15 speakers $1299.00 retail
http://www.dynaudio.com/eng/multimedia/music.php

lynx aes16 sound card $700.00
http://www.lynxstudio.com/product_detail.asp?i=13

yeah, i know, i'm waaaay over budget & i didn't even include a video card yet... argggh!

[Blaster3]

Originally Posted by jdeb looks like he has got a nice little system already. What is wrong with what is in his signature? Just curious. Maybe a sound card and some sound deadening material? http://www.directron.com/audiophle192.html

this will be in a different location...
the dell has no room for any hard drives & adding a music server to it does not make sense to me.

this is what i'll be using for my house system:
http://www.computeraudiophile.com/node/435

or this:
http://www.thecus.com/products_over....nguage=english

wish list for house system:
http://www.novaphysicsgroup.com/Page6.html


i ripp all my cd's as lossless, takes longer, butt it corrects any problems that might exist on the original disc. & i do not use sound leveling during rip/burn.

[mwulf85]

Originally Posted by Blaster3 this will be in a different location... the dell has no room for any hard drives & adding a music server to it does not make sense to me. this is what i'll be using for my house system: http://www.computeraudiophile.com/node/435 or this: http://www.thecus.com/products_over....nguage=english wish list for house system: http://www.novaphysicsgroup.com/Page6.html i ripp all my cd's as lossless, takes longer, butt it corrects any problems that might exist on the original disc. & i do not use sound leveling during rip/burn.

Now I am even more confused…if you going to use a NAS solution for storage, why do you need multiple HDs (or space for them) on this new build? Sorry if I am missing something….

[Blaster3]

Originally Posted by mwulf85 Now I am even more confused…if you going to use a NAS solution for storage, why do you need multiple HDs (or space for them) on this new build? Sorry if I am missing something….

the nas will be for the sound system i have in my home...

the new build music rig will be used at my office...

no need to apologize, i was kinda vague about it, from now on i will try to be much more specific.

ps... i posted my build list for the new rig (somewhere above this post)
wondering if all will work well together & if those p45 chipsets are any good on the motherboard?
i would have liked to try the m-audio 192 sound card butt it seems to be deactivated by newegg.

[liambl]

That PSU is way overkill for that rig, you could run something much less powerful and quieter, like the VX450, unless you're planning on a powerful GPU (I didn't even see one in the list, what are your plans?).

[Blaster3]

what is a gpu? ( never mind, googled it)

that psu was the only reasonable one that had 8 sata connectors.

i plan on filling up all 6 HDD bays & using 2 optical drives, thats 8 sata powered units

i will need help to choose a video card to use with that monitor, & i might also decide to watch movies with this rig & any suggestions?

[liambl]

GPU = graphics card/video card.

You could use a less powerful PSU and use power splitters. The problem with running such a high powered PSU in such a rig is that the efficiency will suffer. PSU's reach their best efficiency at around 40-50% load. That 750 is also likely to be louder than a more suitable PSU. Of course the choice is yours if you want the 8 SATA connectors the go for it, the extra power won't hurt.

[Blaster3]

i thought the psu had to have the xtra rail to supply the drives better,
electrician thoughts: sorta like adding a circuit to your kitchen to power your new electric range/oven so as not to overload any other circuits & cause a power failure or fire.
theory must be the same for psu's, no?

by using splitters your adding to the load that rail has available to it. i would think that would not be such a good idea.
ie: +12 rail is good for 18 amps & adding more components with splitters will increases the amp draw, so why take a chance on amp over draw? i'd rather use a unit designed for the extra draw. unless it adversely affects sound quality.

just searched wd site & found out that those particular drives only draw 490mA & 8.4 watts at full load, so maybe using smaller psu with splitters makes sense.

[mwulf85]

Wow, like you say, you’re way over budget…I think we need to talk more about your priorities and what you are trying to accomplish with this PC…

Couple of thoughts along those lines:

Your case cost more than your speakers…now, maybe those are great speakers, I don’t know, I know Klipsch is a respected brand with regard to home speakers…however, as I look though you parts list, I can’t help be stuck with the thought that you seems to be dumping big (perhaps unnecessary) bucks into your case, MB, HDs, etc. and very little in comparison to your speakers…I tend to think that is a little backwards, and I just want to raise the question that you might be compromising too much in a very critical area…any sound system is only as good as its speakers…

Second, you say you rip all your stuff lossless (is there any other way )…are we talking FLAC (or some other lossless compression) or WAV? If it’s FLAC (or something similar), I am not sure I see the need for all that drive space…for 1,500 CDs at an average compression size of 400MB you would only need 600GBs of drive space…if its WAV, why not FLAC?

[XenaWP]

Yes on the Dyns. I have Dyn Contours (1.3, 1.1) in my main audio system ... sweet, sweet sound.

[Blaster3]

i've no idea about MB's, cpu's, cases. i picked those hdd because of reliability & specs linked here: http://www.wdc.com/en/products/products.asp?driveid=488
(dual processors, 32mb cache, stable trac, no-touch ramp load)

after reading those specs i've found out that one of those 1T drives will hold 25,000, 4 minute, uncompressed cd quality music (that's 1667 hours of music)... wow! thats almost all my cd's combined... so maybe getting 2 750gb hdd @ $79 each is a smart idea for now, that will give me enuff 'room' for the OS, software, & my cd's.

with that in mind, i chose the case because it is a 'quiet' case made for music & had the 6 slots for hdd, although that now seems a bit 'much'... perhaps a case with 4 hdd slots will be enuff? any recommendations?

now it also seems i can go with a much cheaper PSU also.

as far as mobo & cpu, sound card, what would you recommend, based on the fact that this will be a 'music' only system, no editing, just rip/burn with mediamonkey.
just two channel audio playback, no sound effects or surround.

i have been using WMP 11 on the dell in my sig, as that is all i have at the moment.
i rip with WMP 11 in lossless ( highest sampling rate) because i found it 'repairs' any damaged sectors/ skips on cd's my wife lends out, & i prefer not to use sound leveling because it seems to 'flatten' the sound out too much for me, also when i burn from the lossless files, it seems to 'clear' things up, vocals/instruments are easier to hear & are crisp, almost as good as a store bought SACD.
now for the 'front end'... speakers of choice for me are dynaudio mc 15, butt at $1299/pair that will have to wait. those klipsch speakers were the only ones available at newegg so i just included those for now, butt i would like some advice on those as well, i have little knowledge/experience with pc speakers.

perhaps a lot less ram will be next on the list.

i will need some form of video to run the monitor, will a mobo with onboard video work?

thanks again.

[Blaster3]

Originally Posted by XenaWP Yes on the Dyns. I have Dyn Contours (1.3, 1.1) in my main audio system ... sweet, sweet sound.

damm right, xena

i have the 5.4's on my home system... couldn't think of life without 'em
amazing sound
it's PFM (Pure F---in Magic)
i love 'em, probably more than i should, at least that's what the wife says.

[liambl]

Onboard audio will work fine for what you are using the PC for. That also means you can go quite low on the PSU, further reducing cost and noise/heat.

[whubbard]

Blaster,

The one thing I would add is that as liambl just pointed out, the onboard output will be just fine. If you really want to improve the sound coming out of your computer, its a good DAC that you'll need.
I've got a very nice small setup that works perfectly for listening at the levels I think you will be in your office.

Lenovo -> Digital Out (Dock) -> Zero DAC -> HK3485 -> Infinity Beta 20s.

It really removes the computer from the equation.


I should add that I am building a $1.4k Music Computer soon. It will be going into my main rig at home ($13k+ speakers and amps, and a few more $k for the sources (McIntosh and Rega)), so its got a lot to stand up too. It's also going to be controlled by a Touchscreen monitor, and I want it to run beautifully. Now even for this (after a bit of debate), I will be using the onboard digital out. I will be using a much nicer DAC, but once again the onboard.

So if you really care about sound quality...get a really good DAC...and use whatever computer you already have. If you need a new computer, for Audio, I would say the most important part is the HD. For the rest of it, if it works, it will sound the same, and you won't notice much difference. Also, those Klipsch speakers are going to be pretty poor SQ. I wouldn't dare call them Audiophile.

^^I hope you find something above useful, didn't seem to make much sense to me at the end^^

-West

[Blaster3]

fist i'd like to point out that the set up hubbard has suggested, although a good one, defeats my purpose. for one thing, it will take up way too much space having all those components, secondly, that set-up makes the computer nothing more than an ordinary cd/dvd player.

my intention was to be able to store my music, without having a wall cabinet full of cd's, & to listen to 'em the way i enjoy hearing them.
i know i will have to make compromises in order to accomplish my goal & remain on budget.
i don't expect to get anywhere near the sound quality of my home system on this new build.

perhaps i should just get a quality sound card, & speakers for the ole dell in my sig & continue just using burned copies of my cd's at work, although i would like to store them on a hdd, perhaps a 1T external hdd.

any suggestions for a nice set of pc speakers (2 channel)

i'm thinkin of this sound card:
http://ixbtlabs.com/articles2/esi-julia/
if it will work in my ole dell

was planning on using mediamonkey as player
unless the one that comes with that card is better? any thoughts on it?
has anyone had any experience with juli@ ?

thanks again

my original plan to build a rig was just so i can experience building one, butt it seems that what my goal is for sound, i'd probably better off just utilizing the ole dell & update the sound card & speakers. & wait until i need a new comp & build it myself.

[mwulf85]

Originally Posted by Blaster3 fist i'd like to point out that the set up hubbard has suggested, although a good one, defeats my purpose. for one thing, it will take up way too much space having all those components, secondly, that set-up makes the computer nothing more than an ordinary cd/dvd player.

Thanks for the clarification… I tend to agree with hubbard’s comments…but if you’re dead set about not using an external DAC, then there is no reason to beat a dead horse….

any suggestions for a nice set of pc speakers (2 channel) i'm thinkin of this sound card: http://ixbtlabs.com/articles2/esi-julia/ if it will work in my ole dell

I’ve heard good things about these speakers….http://www.audioengineusa.com/a5_home.php

was planning on using mediamonkey as player unless the one that comes with that card is better? any thoughts on it? has anyone had any experience with juli@ ?

After years of using Foobar, I recently move to MM…I am very happy I did…

my intention was to be able to store my music, without having a wall cabinet full of cd's, & to listen to 'em the way i enjoy hearing them. i know i will have to make compromises in order to accomplish my goal & remain on budget. i don't expect to get anywhere near the sound quality of my home system on this new build. perhaps i should just get a quality sound card, & speakers for the ole dell in my sig & continue just using burned copies of my cd's at work, although i would like to store them on a hdd, perhaps a 1T external hdd. my original plan to build a rig was just so i can experience building one, butt it seems that what my goal is for sound, i'd probably better off just utilizing the ole dell & update the sound card & speakers. & wait until i need a new comp & build it myself.

You probably are, and think that’s the part that is tripping myself and others up…to do what you are wanting to do, doesn’t really take a lot of PC…your current Dell, plus a new sound card, the best set of speakers you can find/afford and a new HD and/or an external HD is really all you need…a new build won’t sound any better imo…(so long as that Dell isn’t a noise monster, that is)…

[jdeb]

http://www.slipperybrick.com/category/companies/onkyo/

[Blaster3]

Originally Posted by mwulf85 I’ve heard good things about these speakers….http://www.audioengineusa.com/a5_home.php After years of using Foobar, I recently move to MM…I am very happy I did…

thanks, i think i'll get those A5's in black, so far cheapest i found 'em was $325

& the juli@ soundcard $142

seems like a nice upgrade
i just recently switched to mediamonkey & so far i like it much better than wmp or winamp
only thing is you have to pay in order to be capable of ripping at full speeds. butt its worth the $19.99 or $39.99 lifetime.

this is what came with the ole dell:
sound blaster audigy 2 zs & dell 5650 speakers seen here: http://www.outletpc.com/c5187.html... yukk, don't know how i put up with that all this time

btw, how do i tell the diff between a pci & pci express slot? don't want to order the wrong type sound card.
there is 1 black slot with video card in it & 2 white slots 1 with the sound card & the other a modem card i believe.

you all have convinced me to upgrade the ole dell's sound instead of building new, i appreciate all your input & advice, thanks again.

[whubbard]

The ZERO DAC is cheaper than that sound card, and will sound better, and be easier to use. (you get a nice headphone out too)Zero Dac
The seller only sells through ebay.

It's not that your computer will just become a CD player, it just become a music server. Just think of the DAC as a better soundcard, thats all.

Also, it doesn't matter what interference is going on inside your computer that could effect analog sound, as it's all digital leaving your machine.

-West