PC Build Component Order?

[jaredallen]

Hello all,

This is my first post and my first time trying to build my own PC. I am doing research into each component that goes into building and was wondering if I could get some advice into the typical order of operations when it comes to deciding components, IE where should I start?

Is the processor the most important, and then I build out from there, or is is the motherboard? Also, should I choose a case first? Thanks so much for your time.

Jared Allen

[Alaron]

Welcome to PCMech.

The best place to start is to choose if you want AMD or Intel. We don't really invite debates on the subject, some folks can get hot headed. Suffice it to say, both brands will perform very well. Choosing one will lead you to your board, CPU model and RAM. Then we can add in things like video cards and drives.

Also, it is helpful to know what you'll be using the machine for, and what your budget is. Then we can help you put together a great list.

[Khalil]

Hello Jarred, most important component in a computer is the power supply. Like Alaron said, depending on what you will be using it for we can advise on what to use.
Currently both AMD and Intel are making awesome CPUs, with the right chip sets either make can work for you very well.

[LeftyAce]

To elaborate on Khalil's point...The powersupply _is_ incredibly important, but what you need depends on the rest of the parts, which in turn depend on your intended use and budget.

As Alaron said, pick a CPU, that'll determine your motherboard and ram options...video card depends on what you want to do with the computer, and the powersupply depends on all of the above.

[jaredallen]

(If you just want an answer to your immediate questions, I believe they are AMD, lots of internet surfing and video watching, very minimal gaming, and under $1000. Now, if you'd like to hear me ramble, please read on...)



Ah, this is nice. It's rare to get such good interaction online. I'm looking forward to picking some brains here...

To start with, I should say I'm doing this just as much to build it as to use it. I've decided to start treating my computer a little more as an end instead of just a means to one. So, I want it to look semi-respectable, but very simple.

My most important factor is reliability. I'm tired of being frustrated with my computer and helpless to do anything about it. I don't mind if something goes wrong, but if it can't be narrowed down quickly, it's usually endless. So I want to know that hardware isn't the issue, if possible.

I can to spend between $800 and $1000. I want to spend less. But there are a few things I want that I feel may push me closer to my max.

Here's what I want the computer to do (in no particular order):

I would like to try Crysis once at least, but I probably won't play many games until The Old Replublic comes out, so I was thinking of going with integrated video and determining if I need to upgrade when I see it up and running. I will be hooking it up to my Olevia (Target Brand) LCD TV. I want to get a BluRay burner possibly, but I'm not sure if it's worth it. Do you need a better video adapter to play BluRay?

I watch a lot of videos online, and will me doing most of my tv watching from this PC. In the future, I would like to have a split video to my TV and also to another screen, so I don't know how much RAM you really need to keep that stuff going, or if it's just the processor's job....

The reason I say AMD is I feel like I'm paying for the name on Intel products.... Bickering aside, can everyone admit that I can at least rely on either brand?

And so I guess it begins here, I saw this at CompUSA:

AMD Phenom X4 9950 Quad Core Processor HD995ZXAGHBOX - Black Edition, 2.60GHz, 4MB Cache, 2000MHz (4000 MT/s) FSB, Agena, Quad-Core, Retail, Socket AM2+, Processor with Fan

I also really like this case (it has huge fans that seem like they would be pretty quiet...)

Cooler Master HAF 932 Full Tower Black Case

Let me know what you think folks, and thanks again!

Jared Allen

[Alaron]

I'll let Khalil and other folks more familiar with AMD spec you a list, but I can answer a few things.

First, quality parts will go a long way toward stability and reliability. And we here at PCM only recommend quality.

I would hold off on the BluRay burner for now, they are still rather expensive. You can always add one to the computer later if you have a big need for one. The video card does not have to be especially powerful for BluRay, and for your budget, we can definitely include one that will be plenty for that and games.

Last, check out www.newegg.com for parts. Excellent prices and service, we recommend them to everyone.

[jaredallen]

I'll check out that site, thanks!

I was checking out CompUSA.com and I noticed a funny trend... The top five selling processors are AMD, and yet the top five selling motherboards are for i7 Intel or some other Intel CPU. Is it just that time in the cycle or is there some weird price reasons?

I'm leaning towards this motherboard because I like the three year warranty...


ASUS M3N78-EM Motherboard - NVIDIA GeForce 8300, Socket AM2+, ATX, HDMI, PCI Express 2.0, Gbit LAN, USB 2.0, eSATA, RAID

I also don't notice a wattage indication on the specs for any of the motherboards... Does that mean the motherboard doesn't need to be connected to the powersource?

Thanks folks,

Jared Allen

[Khalil]

My guild and I will be going to old republic when it is out. SWG was a huge disapointment and we are looking forward to the new game.

Yes you can rely on both brands. Both AMD and Intel are very reliable and will do the job.
The trick is picking the rest of the hardware to go around the processors.
Would you like me to give you a list that will work real well for you?

[LeftyAce]

I also don't notice a wattage indication on the specs for any of the motherboards... Does that mean the motherboard doesn't need to be connected to the powersource?

No, the motherboard must be connected to the powersupply, but what determines the power requirements is all the other components.

Are you planning on doing a good deal of gaming once old republic comes out?
If you want to run Crysis at all, you need a good video card. If all you're going to do is dabble with a game or two, a good video card is a lot of money to spend.

[jaredallen]

Khalil,

I never actually got to play SWG, but I've heard the stories from before Sony got hold of it and screwed it up. I'm looking forward for sure to see what Bioware can do with this...

As far as the list, I would certainly appreciate any suggestions you may have, but I really would like to understand why the components work together, instead of just letting you do all the work and taking your word for it. I'd like to be confident in what I did and why I did it after I finish the build. So although I may take a while researching what is what, I'll probably still wind up using what you suggest in the long run, while also walking away with much more PC wisdom than I began with...

I'm very patient and I'm not concerned with getting it done quickly, just right, you know? So, thank you, yes I would love to hear your advice.

LeftyAce,

Thanks for that info on the motherboard. So is there no limit on the amount of total wattage that can go through a power supply to the other components?

I probably do not want to spend the money for an amazing video card if I don't have to. I heard the graphics on SWTOR is going to be pretty basic so they can mass market it. I can deal with some skipping in the video with Crysis. How good are the integrated video adapters on the new AMDs?

Thanks again everyone,

Jared Allen

[glc]

I would not buy from CompUSA - they are now owned by Systemax, who is the parent company of Tiger Direct.

There is no integrated video on ANYTHING that can handle Crysis. I wouldn't bother with integrated video and I'd plan on a $150 or so video card. With a $1000 budget, that shouldn't be a problem to fit in.

[jaredallen]

Originally Posted by glc I would not buy from CompUSA - they are now owned by Systemax, who is the parent company of Tiger Direct. There is no integrated video on ANYTHING that can handle Crysis. I wouldn't bother with integrated video and I'd plan on a $150 or so video card. With a $1000 budget, that shouldn't be a problem to fit in.

What's so bad about Tiger Direct? I know CompUSA is the same company, but I'm looking for manufacturer's warranties right? I just have one that I can drive to here, and it's much nicer for getting things like cases, not having to pay shipping on returns, or just good deals...

Also, is it not typical and/or a hassle to just get a motherboard that has integrated video as well as support for an external adaptor? Like I said, Crysis most definitely takes a back seat to everything else. I will not be spending $150 to play one game. Period.

Lastly, and this is something I most likely should have mentioned earlier, I would like for this system to be QUIET. I had an Xbox 360 way back in the day and I remember how loud that thing was... I don't mind a little hum and breeze, but I only need one vacuum.

Thanks again,
Jared Allen

[Khalil]

You won't be able to even install the new Bioware Star Wars game without a good video card. I am in Beta now for it on and off and when I tried it with an Nvidia 9800GT it was barely playable but it plays really well with my 4870X2 video card.
If you want to game you will need a PCI-Express video card, no way to do it with onboard unless you are thinking of solitaire

[jaredallen]

So I'm starting to get the idea that maybe integrated video is a joke.... If that is how it must be, then I will most likely need a video card for sure. I need to do some research into what sort of spec's to look for in a good adapter, so I'll start on that after I get the motherboard and CPU squared away.

Here's my question: Is all that amazing video even going to be worth it on my TV? Won't I be missing out without a true computer LCD?

[LeftyAce]

You said you wanted to know what was going on, and I might have taken that to an extreme. This post is waaaaaaaay too long, but it's my best stab at a break down of why we recommend what we do, and how we go about designing machines.

I understand your interest in knowing what's going on. I was the same way :-)

There are 2 things we're going to be doing when we recommend parts. First we'll be recommending quality manufacturers. How do we know that? Many of the regulars on the site build and/or support computers for a living (Khalil, glc, and many others). Personally, I tend to parrot their recommendations; I figure it saves them repeating themselves quite so much :-)

Then we're going to be picking parts that are compatible.

You pick out a CPU first. Particular CPUs have specific interfaces (the number and arrangement of pins on the bottom of the chip), so they require a motherboard that has that type of socket. They are also designed such that they require certain types of memory (ram). You have to make sure you get a motherboard that supports your CPU and the required ram. Then you pick ram that is compatible.

The CPU has a certain speed at which it interacts with the other components (mainly ram); you need to make sure the ram you get is fast enough, but there's no sense getting anything faster, as it'll be more expensive, and just automatically slow down to let the CPU keep up.

Video card depends on your budget and intended use. Since you're going to be gaming, and your budget allows for it, a good video card is pretty much essential. Because AMD owns ATI, using an ATI video card is recommended with an AMD processor. Personal research (googling benchmarks, trying different cards, etc) gives us a good idea of good "bang for your buck" cards (absolute bleeding edge is disproportionately expensive for the performance gain you'd get, for instance).

At that point, you know enough to pick a powersupply. Again, personal experience dealing with bunches of units has resulted in a community database of powersupply quality, (found here). You can look up the power requirements for the processor and video card, or use one of the many PSU wattage calculators available online to figure out how much juice you need.

Now you have the "high performance" parts of the computer; the stuff that determines how well it'll game, how fast it'll feel, etc.

Harddrive, again, combination of first-hand use knowledge and benchmark tests give us a pretty good idea who is making the most reliable and fastest drives. Right now, Western Digital offers the best warranty (5 years), which is a good indicator of their quality....plus if they're wrong, and the drive dies sooner, they have to replace it for free :-). The Caviar Black models have a large onboard cache, which speeds up access times, making those models some of the fastest available desktop drives. There's a sweet spot in terms of $/GB, and that's what we recommend unless you know you'll need more storage than that in the near future.

Optical drives, again, community knowledge on reliability based on years of dealing with dead drives :-) You'll want a DVD burner (which also reads and burns CDs), mainly because they're barely more expensive (as in, a couple bucks) than a straight CD burner, and that way you have the capability if you need it.

Case is entirely your own choice. Feel free to check out stuff in stores, but you are almost guaranteed to get a better deal at newegg.com

As far as newegg vs tigerDirect or CompUSA....look up components on newegg, and compare prices at compUSA. I guarantee you'll be astounded at how much higher they are in-store. Even though most things are manufacturer warrantied, getting quality parts reduces the chances you'll have to deal with that in the first place.

[Khalil]

Here is the big question, when are you looking to buy your hardware? ATI will have the new 58xx series cards out in a couple of months. AMD has new CPUs coming out as well so is Intel. Computer hardware changes from month to month. You don't seem to be in a hurry this is why I ask.
To answer your questions about what works best with what. Generally, you want to stay away from VIA and SIS chipsets. Intel Chipsets will work very nicely with both ATI and Nvidia video cards.
On the AMD side, ATI Video cards work best with AMD Chipsets, in my opinion. Nvidia video cards work best with Nvidia chipests when using AMD processors.
Intel however work best with Intel, If choose to go with an Intel CPU I highly recommend you stick to an Intel Chipset.
Power supply is paramount when it comes to a gaming rig. Once we figure out when you are making a move it will be easier to make recomendations.

[LeftyAce]

Integrated video is fine for solitaire and web browsing. As soon as you want to do anything more intensive, you're looking at a discrete video card.

Here's my question: Is all that amazing video even going to be worth it on my TV? Won't I be missing out without a true computer LCD?

What kind of TV is it?

[jaredallen]

Very good information. I will process this and have more questions tomorrow...

LeftyAce,

Thank you for that detail, very well put. I've been looking on NewEgg quite a bit now, and you're right, they have some sweet deals!

Khalil,

I'm patient like a patient monster, I want to have fun and do all this at my own pace. All that stuff that's about to come out brand new will be hella expensive though, right? Or are you just saying that the stuff I would buy right now may go down in price?

How can you tell what type of chipset is on a motherboard? I can't find a label "chipset" in the specs.

LeftyAce,

332H LCD HD-Ready TV (My TV)

Nothing special

Thanks,
Jared Allen

[LeftyAce]

When new things come out, the prices for the old stuff goes down. You then have the option of getting newer stuff, or slightly older stuff for cheaper. If new models are about to come out, they're worth waiting for.

If you look at the "specifications" tab in the motherboard listings on newegg you'll see the socket and chipset info. In a store, that stuff is listed on the box.

That TV is 1366x768 which is a kind of "medium" resolution. You may decide after trying it that that's ok. You'll probably want higher resolution so you get better detail, and can fit more units on the screen. Either way, you'll certainly need more than onboard video to get a playable framerate.

[glc]

Tiger Direct is famous for selling distressed merchandise - and they have some of the most creative writers in the business. The way they describe things, they can make a turd look like a nugget of gold.

You can generally tell in a motherboard's description what chipset it has.

ASUS P5Q LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
ASUS P5N-D LGA 775 NVIDIA nForce 750i SLI ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
ASUS M3N78-VM AM2+/AM2 NVIDIA GeForce 8200 HDMI Micro ATX AMD Motherboard - Retail
ASUS M4A78 Plus AM3/AM2+/AM2 AMD 770 ATX AMD Motherboard - Retail

Your TV has a HDMI input, so ideally you should use a video card that has a HDMI output. This is a great deal here:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814102824

It will handle Crysis fine at reasonable settings.