Gaming, Web/Graphics Design PC... what next?

[John R]

I just purchased an hp workstation (xw5000). (specs below)

I will be using this pc for gaming (medieval total war and world of warcraft) as well as web/graphics design (photoshop cs2/3, dreamweaver, and other site builders) and also web browsing.

The pc surrently has ECC memory installed and it seems fine except for when playing world of warcraft (nice ammount of lag/latency), however, when playing Medieval total war, there are no such issues.

I am wondering what to upgrade or change in order to get the fasted improvement as well as fix the lag problem with world of warcraft.

I am also curious if I can change out the ECC memory with DDR memory by simply changing the ram chips or is there a more complex process?

The "dxdiag" run is listed below for the system and video card... please give some advice as far as upgrades and fixing the ram issue.

thank you in advance

Operating system: Microsoft Windows XP Professional (5.1, build 2600)
System Manufacturer: Hewlett-Packard
System Model: hp workstation xw5000
Processor: Intel (R) Pentium(R) 4CPU 2.40 GHz
Memory: 1022MB RAM
DirectX Version: DirectX 9.0c (4.09.0000.0904)


Display tab
]Device Name: RADEON 7000 SERIES
Driver Version: 6.14.0010.6614 (english)
Driver Date: 5/03/06 12:51:00
Driver DDI Version: 9 or higher
DirectDraw Acceleration: Enabled
Direct3D Acceleration: Enabled
AGP Texture Acceleration: Enabled

[glc]

Your problems with WoW are due to the weak video card.

Honestly, there is no way you are going to turn an old professional workstation into a gamer. Don't waste your money even trying.

http://www.crucial.com/store/listpar...Compaq&cat=RAM

That machine does not support standard ram - ECC is required.

[John R]

i apologize for the cross posting, I had 2 different goals on each post. sorry they were so similar...

with the link that you posted, there was a question in the FAQs that asks: Does my computer support ECC memory? the reply is:

"Your system supports ECC. You can put non-ECC modules into an ECC system, but be sure not to mix ECC and non-ECC modules within a system. Install the same type of modules that are already in your system."

does this mean I can replace with regular ram?... Im a little confused. (please excuse my ignorance... that is why im here...lol)

[Masaki 7-11]

Originally Posted by John R i apologize for the cross posting, I had 2 different goals on each post. sorry they were so similar... with the link that you posted, there was a question in the FAQs that asks: Does my computer support ECC memory? the reply is: "Your system supports ECC. You can put non-ECC modules into an ECC system, but be sure not to mix ECC and non-ECC modules within a system. Install the same type of modules that are already in your system." does this mean I can replace with regular ram?... Im a little confused. (please excuse my ignorance... that is why im here...lol)

Not sure if your motherboard supports both ECC and non-ECC ram, however there are a few reasons for not upgrading the ram; XP works great with 1GB of ram, in a high-end computer more memory would be beneficial, but for your computer 1GB is fine. For a workstation ECC ram is preferred since it is more reliable than non-ECC ram and current prices for DDR1 ram both ECC and non-ECC ram is very high compared to faster DDR2 and DDR3 ram.

Ideally you would build a computer with new parts since even a low cost computer (like $500) would be much faster than your computer, however if you want to use your computer, the only worthwhile upgrade would be to upgrade your video card since that's most likely what's slowing you down in gaming, a good somewhat inexpensive ($80) card for your setup would be this: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814103080

[EzyStvy]

Originally Posted by John R "Your system supports ECC. You can put non-ECC modules into an ECC system, but be sure not to mix ECC and non-ECC modules within a system. Install the same type of modules that are already in your system." does this mean I can replace with regular ram?... Im a little confused. (please excuse my ignorance... that is why im here...lol)

Accoring to the statement - if all ram is NON ecc you're good to go.

[glc]

I question that in this case - if you notice, the ONLY listed compatible ram is ECC. I suppose if you have a standard DDR module that you could test with, go for it, you won't damage anything.

I have looked up other ECC systems on Crucial before, and seen both types listed as compatible.

Before upgrading the video card, you need to see what HP put in that thing for a power supply. It may not be strong enough for a modern video card (if anything AGP is "modern").

[Masaki 7-11]

Originally Posted by glc I question that in this case - if you notice, the ONLY listed compatible ram is ECC. I suppose if you have a standard DDR module that you could test with, go for it, you won't damage anything. I have looked up other ECC systems on Crucial before, and seen both types listed as compatible. Before upgrading the video card, you need to see what HP put in that thing for a power supply. It may not be strong enough for a modern video card (if anything AGP is "modern").

According to HP's website the power supply that it comes with is 320W with PFC.
http://h18000.www1.hp.com/products/q.../11505_na.HTML

[glc]

That's not enough for any substantial gaming card.

[Masaki 7-11]

Originally Posted by glc That's not enough for any substantial gaming card.

It'll be enough for the HD4650 since it doesn't use up much more than the Radeon 7000. The power supply should be able to deliver it's stated wattage since it has PFC (which all high-end power supplies have and very few if any have it). The system's power usage should top out at 300W if everything is at 100%, so under normal load (including gaming and such) the usage will be around 260W.

[Khalil]

glc is correct, I thought 350W was enough for the 4650 video cards and I learned the hard way and ended up replacing 20 of them this year from earlier builds. That power supply won't last long with the ATI 4650

[Masaki 7-11]

Originally Posted by Khalil glc is correct, I thought 350W was enough for the 4650 video cards and I learned the hard way and ended up replacing 20 of them this year from earlier builds. That power supply won't last long with the ATI 4650

What other components did you put in your builds? The older pentium 4s don't consume that much power and a good 300W+ power supply will handle an HD4650 fine. I had one of my rigs running a 9600GSO (which has a decent bit more power usage than the HD4650) for about half a year doing folding and gaming fine with a 350W Powerman (InWin) power supply before I upgraded the power supply (the 350W is still running fine in another rig). [Other components for the 9600GSO include the Core 2 Duo E6600, Intel G965 based motherboard, 2x1GB DDR2-667, 500GB Seagate Barracuda, Lite-On 22x DVD+/-RW and 3 120mm fans running at medium speed (1600 RPM)].

From the power supply calculator (http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp), you can find out that the difference in power consumption between the Radeon 7000 and the HD4670 (don't have the HD4650, but the HD4670 uses up more power so the comparison should work fine either way) is that the HD4670 uses up 17 more watts than the Radeon 7000.

[dabro15]

Just out of curiosity what is your normal latency in WoW? If you are running a wired connection your fine but wireless can be sketchy with that game. WoW does use a good amount of bandwidth so I will get terrible lag/latency if my wireless connection is not Excellent/5 bars on wireless-G. Playing other online games are fine but WoW can give me a hard time w/ connection issues.

[Khalil]

Originally Posted by Masaki 7-11 What other components did you put in your builds? The older pentium 4s don't consume that much power and a good 300W+ power supply will handle an HD4650 fine. I had one of my rigs running a 9600GSO (which has a decent bit more power usage than the HD4650) for about half a year doing folding and gaming fine with a 350W Powerman (InWin) power supply before I upgraded the power supply (the 350W is still running fine in another rig). [Other components for the 9600GSO include the Core 2 Duo E6600, Intel G965 based motherboard, 2x1GB DDR2-667, 500GB Seagate Barracuda, Lite-On 22x DVD+/-RW and 3 120mm fans running at medium speed (1600 RPM)]. From the power supply calculator (http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp), you can find out that the difference in power consumption between the Radeon 7000 and the HD4670 (don't have the HD4650, but the HD4670 uses up more power so the comparison should work fine either way) is that the HD4670 uses up 17 more watts than the Radeon 7000.

Those systems if I remember correctly had AMD Athlon AM2 6400, 320GB SATA hard drive, 4GB DDR2 800 memory Dual Optical Drives and the Asus ATI 4650, the FSP 350W I were using did not cut it and they would constantly shut down during intense gaming. I upgraded them all to Seasonic SS500ET Bronze and everyone is happy now!

[Masaki 7-11]

Originally Posted by Khalil Those systems if I remember correctly had AMD Athlon AM2 6400, 320GB SATA hard drive, 4GB DDR2 800 memory Dual Optical Drives and the Asus ATI 4650, the FSP 350W I were using did not cut it and they would constantly shut down during intense gaming. I upgraded them all to Seasonic SS500ET Bronze and everyone is happy now!

The Athlon 64 X2 uses up ALOT of power (125W), which is probably why the power supplies couldn't take it. A 2.4 GHz P4 takes between 60W to 90W depending on the model (the northwood version uses 59.8W, the prescott version uses up 89W and the northwood with HT uses 66.2W). The HD4650 isn't a very power hungry card as it doesn't even have a PCIe power connector meaning that it stays within the 75W that the PCIe slot provides.

[Khalil]

It is always advisable to have extra power and amps, the difference in price is so little and we are talking about the most important component in the machine!!