Some advice to future A64 overclockers.

[Tin]

Ive been seeing posts in numerous threads concerning the memory dividers on the A64 architecture. They are confusing, so allow me to shed some of that confusion for you. A common misconception with A64s, is that they run better when run 1:1, meaning the memory and hypertransport are in synch with one another. Dont get me wrong, they do run better, but the difference is pretty negligible. Memory timings also dont play as crucial of a role...but as always, running 1:1 with the tightest timings possible will give the best results, but truth is most of us dont have the cash to spend on memory that will clock that high. This is where the A64 shines...you can take that value memory and still get a nice overclock...you wont be too far behind the guys with the big dollar stuff. Also, running at something like 3-4-4-10 wont have much of an impact on performance, since the A64 isnt very picky about timings....unlike its Athlon XP predecessor.

Now for the fun part...memory dividers. If you look through your BIOS, you should see something along the lines of maximum memory speed...and there should be 4 different settings...100, 133, 166, and 200. This is the confusing part...alot of peope would look at that and think their true max memory speed would be whatever is selected. This is a very deceiving part of the BIOS, because in actuality, that is your memory divider setting. If you look in the above paragraph, youll see I mention running memory at 1:1, but if you look closely in the BIOS, your memory speed is set to 200 by default, which means its running 1:1 at 200MHz. Thats all fine and dandy if youre running stock, but once you start cranking up the hypertransport speed, you will come to a point where you may have to run on a divider. Lets face it....youll hit a brick wall sometime down the line forcing you to run a divider. Say you want to hit 280HTT, but you know your memory wont go that far 1:1, so the better idea would be to select the 166 divider. This will put you on a 5:6 divider, 5 / 6 = 0.83, meaning the 166 divider makes your memory run at 83% of the HTT speed. You reach your 280HTT, but on a 166 divider, which means your memory, being at 83% of the HTT speed, is effectively running at 233MHz. Here is a little chart for you to follow:

If memory speed is:
200, youre running 1:1, or 100% of the hypertransport (HTT) speed.
166, 5:6, or 83%
133, 2:3, or 66%
100, 1:2, or 50%

[ESCAPEMAX]

I have my GigaByte GAK8NS and Sempron 3100+ set for 240. Effectively turned a 1.8Ghz into a 2.16Ghz. And temps stay low with a stock cooler.
So is this good or bad?
In the future I plan on upgrading to a 64 Bit cpu. Any advice on the Sempron 64?
Thanks
Chris

[Tin]

Sempron 64s are overclocking monsters. A member here, g-dogg, has one that really screams...and its a 2600+. The stock cooler isnt bad at all as long as you have ample case cooling, but the higher you go, youre going to eventually come to a point where better cooling will be needed. Im still running the stock cooler on my chip.

[ESCAPEMAX]

So should I go with a Sempron64 3400 or wait and save for a A64 3700?
My Brother gave me the Sempron 3100. Seems to run good for what I was doing. Until Windows shut down. I used an old copy from a previously built PC. Just for testing. Had to use the Maxtor supplied floppy to repartion the HD. Until I can get a copy of Windows 64.
Chris

[Tin]

Get a Turion MT-37. Its a notebook 3700+ thats basically a Socket 754 3700+ San Diego. Its built on the 90nm process like San Diego, and supports SSE3. The big advantage of the MT-37 is that it runs on only 1.2V, so theres very much overclocking headroom .
MWave has the MT-37 in stock for $269. You will need to get a proper cooling fan for it though, since it doesnt have the integrated heatspreader like the desktop CPUs. A good one for such purposes would most likely be a Zalman CNPS7000 series cooler.

PS - Start your own thread .

[[Hound]]

i dont mean to intrude, this being my first post and all, but ive done a lot of research on amd mobiles, as i wanted something that oc'ed like a mofo, and stuff

i was pretty exicted about turions, but there was barely any info about it lol.
turns out a few people have bought it, and well... the low power transistors work really well for what they are meant to do, work on low volts.

but on high voltage this def. works agaisnt the chip, such as 1.6v (not really that high i know but still.) and they produce heat like crazy.

however, the newark cores, which (i think) only have 1024kb cache, oc like mofo's, they used to be hand picked clawhammer cores.... now im pretty sure they are hand picked single channel sandies, and what tin is said is somewhat wrong, the Turion cpu's are designed from ground up to be mobile's there actual core is a "Lancaster".

and no, i forgot what voltage they ran on, i wasted my money before i got to spend any on a pc (god i must be a dumbass lol)

hound

[glc]

Hound, please watch your language, we don't talk like that around here, keep it clean.

[Tin]

The biggest issue for Turions for overclockers compared to Newarks is the fact they use a greater proportion of low power/ high Vt transistors and no bottom capacitor in source/drain as well as a broader voltage spectrum. (Whereas Newarks are esentially cherry picked san diegos on socket 754). While this is good for their proper use (low power consumption) its not good when overclocking as these transistors have a lower drive current.

[jpsilvashy]

i could never succesfully get my fsb and ram speed to line up correctly and have a stable running system, i think i have a bunk mobo anyway.

[arthur666]

I don't see anything in my bios that mentions FSB speed, just the memory speed. How can I be sure I'm running at 1000Mhz?

[Tin]

Originally Posted by arthur666 I don't see anything in my bios that mentions FSB speed, just the memory speed. How can I be sure I'm running at 1000Mhz?

Im unfamiliar with your ULi chipset. Chances are it isnt a choice overclockers chipset...I havent read about anybody OCing on ULi yet. Your HTT multiplier should be at 5x, HTT frequency at 200MHz, and Memory speed at 200MHz on a stock running 939 system.

[Brown Hornet]

that's some good info there Tin,i learned by trial and error and ofcourse forum's like this.got my venice core 3200 up to 2.7

[finboy]

i dont understand this at all. Sorry but im a begginer at this stuff. SO what is the point of dividing . is it faster going 166, what is htt. is it better to have less percentage. and does ocing ram increase processor speed. thanks

[KCD]

finboy, I'm learning also.

As for htt look at the last part of the first post for:

If memory speed is:
200, youre running 1:1, or 100% of the hypertransport (HTT) speed.
166, 5:6, or 83%
133, 2:3, or 66%
100, 1:2, or 50%

For an understanding of those above cited figures go to:

http://www.cpuid.org/cpuz.php

Under the header "Download latest version" click on CPU-Z 1.33 & then after downloading unzip the file.

Open the folder & double click on CPU-Z Application & wait 8 seconds for it to scan your computer.

You will then be given 5 header choices regarding your computer's performance.

For an explanation of those you can do a search on this site or go to:

http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleID=985

and review the good articles there.

For a definition of computer acronyms go here:

http://www.dr-belair.com/dic/Computi...s-glossary.htm

Have a good one.

KCD

[finboy]

ok those really helped but i am still wondering about if a larger cache size and more cycles are better than a small cache size and less cycles. thanks

[KCD]

finboy, glad it helped. As for your question: “i am still wondering about if a larger cache size …”

On the link given earlier:

http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleID=985

had you done a search (upper right corner) for cache the first link listed is

http://www.pcstats.com/search.cfm

and the first item discussed is about the AMD Athlon64 4000+ Socket 939 Processor Review

Clicking on that article’s header will bring you to

http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleID=1666 in which the 3rd para. states:

“Interestingly, the Athlon 64 4000+ is not clocked faster than its nearest predecessor (the Athlon64 3800+, also 2.4GHz) as you might expect, but that doesn't preclude it from obtaining a healthy boost in the benchmarks. Rather than a little bump up to 2.6GHz, the Athlon64 4000+ has had the benefit of some internal core changes to boost its performance. To be specific, the Athlon 64 4000+ contains twice as much Level 2 Cache memory of the Athlon64 3800+. In other words, this chip is packing a full 1MB of exclusive L2.”

So the larger the cache the better, or as Martha Stewart likes to say: “It’s a good thing.”, because it quickens the cpu's response time whether in RAM or on a hard drive. (The older hard drives did not have cache).

Since the pcstats website is set up for beginners doing searches there would probably be more helpful than wadding thru the posts here. Just click on the word beginner & you should arrive here:

http://www.pcstats.com/articlesearch...ch=Get+Listing

Sorry for the detailed explanation just don't know the expertise level you're at.

Have a good one.

KCD

[finboy]

thank you for clearing this up. the links helped a lot

[KCD]

Your welcome. Glad they helped.

KCD

[Khalil]

Originally Posted by Tin Get a Turion MT-37. Its a notebook 3700+ thats basically a Socket 754 3700+ San Diego. Its built on the 90nm process like San Diego, and supports SSE3. The big advantage of the MT-37 is that it runs on only 1.2V, so theres very much overclocking headroom . MWave has the MT-37 in stock for $269. You will need to get a proper cooling fan for it though, since it doesnt have the integrated heatspreader like the desktop CPUs. A good one for such purposes would most likely be a Zalman CNPS7000 series cooler. PS - Start your own thread .

What PC mobo would recognize and work well with this Mobile Processor?
A friend of mine wants me to build him a new machine and I can get this processor for a real good deal.

[KCD]

Khalil,

fwiw this should give you an idea where to start but note the caveat.

After deciding on some board(s) go to the mfgr website to discover complaints, revisions, etc. Then I would start a new tread requesting peoples thoughts.

Have a good one.

KCD

M/B List : Turion64 works

"The below list is collected information that it worked. It does not guarantee the full functional operation."

http://angelfall.s39.xrea.com/area2ch/turion-e.html