Help Me Water Cool My Comp!:)

[kamolahy]

So I want to water cool my system. Right now I run a Radeon X1800 XT and it runs so hot that it beeps sometimes as a warning. I currently pump the fan up to 100% at all times to keep it down to it's lowest idle temperature, which is aobut 75 celcius. But I want to make this machine cool and quiet. It's so hot, I can't even have the side of my computer on!

I have some pics attached and you can see my rig. Mind you, I know NOTHING about water cooling, so I would love some suggestions about what would likely fit in my case and what would be feasable. The case is a Thermaltake Swing case. It's ready to be water cooled (or so I think). What's your input?

The Computer:

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b7...y/P1010121.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b7...y/P1010120.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b7...y/P1010119.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b7...y/P1010118.jpg

[Mr.Ferrari]

Welcome, Please read this first. This is a setup that I had suggested someone else, however it's a good read as I give small explanations to each component and give examples.
***Remember, High temps does not mean you need watercooling, if your under stock operation the stock heatsink if mounted correctly will provide perfectly acceptable temperatures!!****

Originally Posted by Mr.Ferrari Although those temps are perfectly normal. Watercooling is a great venture if you have the time and money. Silence is also a big trait. One thing though. Cooling dual cards might not be possible with 300. But I will try to make as decent of one as possible and stay under 400. The reason why I or anyone with knowledge of wc would never suggest kits is due to their poor poor quality, low performance, and unreliability. Your paying 150, but 1/3 of the price you can get a top of the line air cooler that will equal or beat it, and itll probally last 5x longer. Blocks in these kits break, components corrode, pumps leak/fail. Its best to always go custom and get it done right. 300 should bring about a very decent setup. This is what Id suggest. CPU block- Many many blocks are available. But the two classes of blocks are impingent and non impingent. Impingent have are more restrictive to flow. Commonly using jets, pins, little tunnels and the such. Reason is. The heat is transfered to the copper area and the idea is to get as much heat out of that area as possibe, made more effective by making obstacles so more heat is carried out with the water. These blocks severely restrict the flow of water coming in. But offer better cooling capacity. If paired up with a weak pump, will give you negative effects. But once paired up with the right pump, these truely shine. The others being non impingent. Usually have little to no restriction with the water coming in. Maybye a straight smooth tunnel or two. Or some big wide pins. These are great for loops with low pump pressure. But offer less performance. Main manufacturers are Dangerden, Swiftech, Aquaxtreme, Silverprop. And also some more exotic ones such as little river (also reffered to from the owners name, Cathar) and Ek, also known as Eddy _Ek blocks. The one I would suggest for your setup would be this: Aquaxtreme MP-05 SP LE Make sure you add the 1.00 extra delrin midplate. Its a sturdier compound and is well worth the 1 buck. $76.00 Gpu blocks- Usually a little smaller and more compact then the cpu blocks. There are 3 main manufacturers of these, Eddy_Ek, Dangerden, Swiftech, Aquaxtreme. And there are 2 main types of blocks. Full cover And just gpu. Full cover are made to cover the whole card. These arent any better with temps then the normal blocks, and cooling of the memory doesnt reallyhelp with overclocks, but are very popular for asthetics. Gpu blocks just cover the core of the gpu itself, its important to note that you should buy ramsinks to cover your now exposed ram. Some good ones are swiftechs mc14 ramsinks and ocz's bga sinks. Other wise gpu only blocks are like smaller versions of non impingent cpu blocks. They usually have a few pins, or tunnels, but never use jets or anything of the such you would find in a cpu block. Video cards arent as heat sensitive as cpu's are and all your doing by buying a more restrictive block is hampering the flow. Remember, best way to route a gpu is from the outlet of the cpu to inlet of gpu. Otherwise in the normal gpu area all three of the main blocks are neck to neck with each other. Its usually best policy to go with the one that will Give the least amount of pressure drop (or restriction) One I would suggest is this: Dangerden Maze4 $44.95 each X 2, one for each of your cards. Radiator- The radiator is the heart of your watercooling system. It is what will actually cool down the water. This is done by the water entering into a flat somewhat rectangular line of channel's. protruding out of the channels are fins. Varying by airflow requirement and manufacturer. I suggest you stay away from HW labs "extreme" series of radiators as they require alot of cfm to produce any results and only show performance gains over silent radiators when put through more then 140cfm of air. Ill say right now the most highest performing radiator on the market is the Thermochill PA series. Made in the Uk, they are the most silent, high performing radiators on the market, not only do they have insanely low pressure drop compared to the other radiators, they will cool at 1/4 of the cfm it would take to achieve the same temperatures with any other radiator. However this comes at a price, they tend to be twice as expensive as normal ones. For bang/buck I would suggest the Swiftech MCR series. There are 4 main manufacturers of these. HW Labs, Swiftech, Cooltek, and Thermochill. In order from lowest performing cheapest to highest performing most expensive. Now three main types of radiator: Single or 120mm: A small 120mm radiator. Designed for small loops of just the cpu. Fits 1 120mm fan. Double or 240mm: These are the most recommended, usually used for cpu and gpu loops. Fit 2 120mm fans. Triple or 360mm: Fit a total of 3 120mm fans. Best of the best, if you can fit on in your case go for it. Fit 3 120mm fans. Ok now the only limiting factor is how big of one you can put in your case. Sometimes ppl have to drill holes to get theres to fit. Internal mounting one of these can be hard. And I really cant make a final suggestion until you either show me a pic of your case or give me a link. But if you cant fit on inside your case and want a simple solution, I suggest this: Swiftech's Rad box Heres how it works: http://swiftnets.com/products/MCB-120.asp And the radiator I suggest is: Swiftech MCR 320 $49.99 I would really suggest nothing less, great radiator for the price. Pumps- Pretty obvious. Without one, your parts would be useless. This is what makes the water flow. Too many brands to name. 2 most important things you should look for is head and flow. Pump that I would suggest is: Swiftech MCP 655 $74.99 Great little pump for the price, excellent head and flowrate. Reservoir/T-line- Basically where your water gets filled up from and where its stored. Resevoir is exactly what its name applies. A little tank filled with water. Alot of resevoirs are designed to go in your 5 1/4'' drive bay or just stand somewhere in you case. T-line is just a t- fitting with a few inch tube hanging from it. For ease of use I suggest you stick with the resevoir. And the one I suggest is this: Swiftech mcres micro $19.95 and these are the only guys I know who have it in stock, everbody is out. Tubing- Well this is where your water will travel through. Two of the most popular manufacturers are McMaster and Tygon. Tygon is actually 4x more expensive. Due to its slightly tighter kink radius. But to many, mcmaster is the way to go. @ .49 a foot its a steal compared to tygon, and is just as good. McMaster 1/2id 3/4od $.75 a foot and I suggest atleast get 10ft. @ $7.50 Btw I forgot to mention this but there are two main barb sizes used with watercooling (barbs=the things in which water enters through in your rad, waterblocks, pump, res) For best performance always choose 1/2'' inner dimension (id) and 3/4' od(outerdimension) Clamps- You need to make sure those tubes dont fall off. I suggest breeze hose clamps $.39 for one. Youll need 12. $4.32. Just put them around the hose and tighten. Dont overtighten. Just until you feel the hose slightly bulging around the clamp. Do not overtighten is KEY. Fans- Your radiator is geared toward silence. The fans I suggest are: Best quiet fans out there- Yate Loon $3.99 ea. Youll need a total of 3. Last but not least. Coolant and Additives. The only coolant you should ever use or ever need is Distilled water. And ONLY distilled water. Additives- Additives serve to purpose of anti corrosion and anti algae. Corrosion is especially a issue when mixing metals. But I have comprised a all copper loop so you shouldnt be in too much a need of that. If you want a clear setup I would suggest plain distilled water plus a few drops of iodine to kill the nasties. Otherwise some other popular additives are antifreeze such as Zerex. Add 5 to 10 percent per loop. Around 1 or 2 capfuls. If you want a nice blue color I suggest Pentosin . Use 5 to 10 percent concentration with distilled water. I would also be safe and add 2 to 4 drops of iodine above that if your going that route. Another popular one is Swiftech's Hydrx Gives a nice green color. If you go this route dont add any iodine. And dont use this whole bottle for 1 litre of distilled water like swiftech says. It will destroy and clog your blocks. I would use half or 1/3 the suggested amount. Guides: For a indepth guide I would look at this by maxxxracer: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...ad.php?t=54331 Skip to part 2 and 3 for installtion of your system. Watercooled Case gallery: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...ad.php?t=34877 So you can get a idea as to where to place everything and mount everything. (Skip to the end and go back, so you can see the latest stuff ) *cracks fingers* If you have any further questions feel free to ask. Good luck if you decide to go on with this. Total is ~335 not including rad box. If this is still too much, Ill see where I can cut down, I left some room for it .

After you read this, and still want to do it, then please give me a budget and I will suggest accordingly.

Dont forget, this is water and you take you take the risk of frying your components at anytime. However if you do it properly leaks should be something that shouldnt exist. If you have any further questoins feel free to ask dude.

*note: That guide I linked in the quote, is well, a bit "xtreme", and very very very full proof, so dont worry about the indepth cleaning and stuff such as putting a filter in your loop. Just use common sense and youll be alll good.

[kamolahy]

Well, Say I still wanted to get good air cooling. What could I get that would be quiet. Let's forget about budgeting right now.

Idealistically water cooling sounds cool, but for my level of knowledge, I'm leary. So I wouldn't mind getting better air cooling. I'm just curious, would it help THAT much? Could it truly cool down my GPU like I want it to?

My biggest fault, I'm not using many fans in my case right now. But I'd sure like a really good, powerful fan that can keep the whole place cool, but not at the expense of extremely high noise.

[Mr.Ferrari]

Well watercooling is something that definately needs atleast a 300 dollar budget to do properly. But has great rewards if done the right way. However aircooling is the only thing youll ever need if your not looking for high silence or overclocking. For a stock setup and good flow of air and the stock heatsink should do fine.

And remember, dont ever take the temperature reported by your motherboard to heart. You have to atleast take into account a ~10c variation. This is not the temperature sensors fault, its the motherboards manufacturer's who cant take the time to properly calibrate sensors, thats why you get variations from motherboard to motherboard.

Since you asked about aircooling heres another one of my quotes that im too lazy to type again :

Originally Posted by Mr.Ferrari --------------------------------- -HEATSINKs- Also, Your retail cpu does come with a heatsink fan assembly which if you replace with a aftermarket one you risk voiding your warranty. These however are the best ones regarding overclocking on the market *for your information*: For the cpu I suggest one of the following *keep in mind, you should always double check manufacturers website to insure compatibility with your motherboard*: Scythe Infinity New comer, considered to be tied for the best of the best with thermalright's ultra series. Needs additional fan. Ultra 120 (Best of the best, requires additional fan) Si-128 (lower profile version of ultra 120, just as good, requires additional fan.) Scythe Ninja (comes with fan, heavy, you may want to add a stronger fan in the future if it does not fulfill your needs) XP-90C (great for small form factor, needs additional fan) Arctic Cooling Freezer 64 (great for budget) MST-9775 (great for budget) I tried to list them from best to worst. But bewarned the likes of ultra 120, ninja, si128 are really heavy and huge. Make sure they fit on your motherboard by going to each manufacturer's site and checking compatibility. Also these might take a little patience to intall, just becareful. Ninja is especially annoying when it comes to installation. Make SURE you get the LGA775 ADAPTER CLIP with the XP90C if you do choose it! FANS Quiet fans: The best quiet series fan in the world. Thruthful specs, great static pressure for 25mm width, The BEST cfm to noise ratio. Quiet as heck, but still responds very good to undervolting if you need it quieter then it already is. Yate Loon Another good choice is this delta. http://sidewindercomputers.com/de12trbllows.html <---good static pressure due to its 3 blade design. Performance area. ***On the same page as the link of the Yate Loon I posted above there is a SM version, which is higher cfm, would also be a great choice*** I would suggest a 38mm thick fan, but the clips that come with all the heatsinks are designed for 25mm ones, EXCEPT the thermalright series. So 38mm youll need to be creative as far as mounting goes. I.e zip ties, paperclips. 25mm Enermax Enlobal <---great fan, comes with own speed controller. Good quality Sunon High Med Speed <---great price/performance ratio, not *too* loud, might need a fancontroller depending on your noise tolerance, Sunon High Speed <---Loud needs fan controller to keep quiet. Antec Blue<---blue led, bit loud as well 38mm fans-If used with one of the thermalright heatsinks. Sanyo DENKI 38mm <--One of the best 120x38mm fans on the market, Static pressure is unmatched. VERY LOUD. Besure to use a rheobus to quiet down when not needed. Panaflo M1A Another great choice for 38mm, loud too, remember to use fancontroller to quiet down when not needed. ----------------------------------- Some other sites you might like to browse around: www.sidewindercomputers.com www.petrastechshop.com www.svc.com www.xoxide.com www.jab-tech.com www.heatsinkfactory.com www.coolerguys.com All good bookmarks .

**Remember, if you remove any of your stock heatsinks you do risk voiding manufacturers warranties**

For quiet operation. I would choose one of the thermalright's paired with a quiet fan. If you choose one of the 120mm ones I suggest the Yate loon. However a good choice for small form factor and light use is the thermalright xp90c. Superb heatsink if your not looking at uber ultra high performance. Although this is still one of the higest performing heatsinks on the market. I suggest you pair it up with your choice of a quiet 90-92mm Panaflo. Which you can get from one of the websites I have listed. They have truthful specs so you can trust the db numbers. Choose something under 30db.

[jfk]

Originally Posted by kamolahy Right now I run a Radeon X1800 XT and it runs so hot that it beeps sometimes as a warning. I currently pump the fan up to 100% at all times to keep it down to it's lowest idle temperature, which is aobut 75 celcius.

Whoa!!!! You run the stock fan at 100% and it IDLES at 75C? That is way high. My X1900 use to run at 90C under LOAD and idle in the low 50's before I replaced the stock heatsink and fan. You might try reseating the heatsink and fan on it OR putting in an aftermarket cooler. Both Arctic Cooling and Zalman make excellent aftermarket coolers for video cards.

[Mr.Ferrari]

I personally used to use Accelero X2. I would highly suggest it.

[jayb1234]

Is that fan on the side of the case blowing out?

If it is reverse it and let it blow in, if you have too many fans pulling air out it causes lowered air pressure in the case and hurts the cooling performance.

General rule of thumb is front and sides in back out.

And get what wires you can out of the airflow paths.

I'm not a watercooling expert, but it looks like it might be a little tight fitting it in.

You could possibly move your harddrives up to the 5.25 bays and free up some space.

Kind of hard to tell without all the dimensions , case, water components etc.

[kamolahy]

Well I have to apologize as I don't know too much about this stuff.

problem #1 - I have 1 fan on the whole case pulling air out. No fan on the side or anything.

problem #2 - The X1800 has a big plastic case on it. I don't know if it shouldn't and I should have taken it off, but I've wondered how it'ssupposed tostay cool with the heavy plastic covering.

p.s. I'm going to feel like the biggest ass if that was supposed to come off initially. ugh.

well here you go as a reference to what it looks like

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ShowIm...ard+%2D+Retail

I haven't done anything crazy to it. It's just been put in the system. It idles that high all the time. I haven't overclocked and even when I'm playing games that don't use as much power like guild wars or world of warcraft.. it gets up to 90+... and that's when the side of the case is off..

...today it got up to 107 celcius

[Mr.Ferrari]

Hm, looking at your case, I really dont see any space in the interior for the rad. Unless your handy and willing with a holesaw.

I would suggest you atleast get a dual rad if you ever do go watercooling, and I think the best way for you to mount it would be with the swiftech rad box. Its just hard getting just big radiators into medium towers, or towers with no mesh front.

No no no leave that platic covering on. It has nothing to do with the cooling, there is a blowerfan on the front of the card exausting hot air from the copper block that sits atop the gpu.

Do you atleast have one fan blowing in the case from the front?

A fan on the side could really help.

Otherwise I see no reason why your gpu is running so dang hot. Its cooling is not reliant on case air (mostly), it does its own job with the blower fan. But 100percent just for 75c?

[blue60007]

That cover is supposed to funnel air through the heatsink and out the back. That fan moves air laterally (sideways) instead of through it (like a case fan). I can imagine if that plastic cover is removed it won't get airflow through the heatsink and cause overheating problems (even worse ones!).

The fan pulls air from the opposite end on the picture you linked to and blows it out the "grating" you see in the picture. That cover just directs the air through. Since it's pulling air from the middle of the case, you have to make sure there's plent of fresh air for it.

[kamolahy]

well... I don't know what i'm gonna do...

I'm gonna look into some options

I had a pci slot fan that I put under the GPU and thought it might help cool it, but I don't know anymore since that cover is on it. It didn't really effect it.

It seems though that it's definitely running way too hot. I submitted a ticket with ATI but they've never really responded to me effectively

[jayb1234]

I assumed that you already had an 80 mm fan in the side mount.

Put one in there and there is a mount for one, looks like its 120mm in front of the harddrive cage.

Between the two of them, it should improve the volume of air moving through the case significantly, and is likely to solve the problem.

Both of those should blow in.