PCI Express question

[Endless Pain]

I've been trying to find out information both on this site and on the rest of the web about this topic, but all I get a conflicting opinions/facts. What I'm trying to figure out is if you can fit a regular PCI card in either a PCI express X1 slot or in a PCI express X16 slot. On Wikipedia it said that PCI express slots are backwards compatible with regular PCI, but then an old thread on this site said that they are not. Someone please help me with this question, because if they are not backwards compatible, then more than half of retail computers have one out of four expansion slots which is completely useless(referring to the PCI express X1 slot, since they no longer make PCI express X1 cards; also referring to boards with 2 regular PCI slots, 1 PCI express X1 slot, and 1 PCI express X16 slot).

[juppy]

No, they won't work, AFAIK. The x1 slot would be too small for regular PCI and the x16 slot, while physically long enough, I think you'll find it is keyed differently, so the card wouldn't go down in the slot without really hard pushing and breaking it. Now, on the other hand, a PCI-E card will work in any other PCI-E slot it can physically fit in. So, in other words, an x1 card would work in any PCI-E slot, and x4 would work in any PCI-E slot *except* the x1 slot, etc. Where did you hear they were no longer making x1 cards, because I haven't read that anywhere yet?

[RJ]

What I'm trying to figure out is if you can fit a regular PCI card in either a PCI express X1 slot or in a PCI express X16 slot

Nope, it's not possible. PCI and PCI-e are incompatible to one another.

PCI cards won't run in PCI-e slots or vice versa.

On Wikipedia it said that PCI express slots are backwards compatible with regular PCI

Where'd you read that ? On Wikipedia it says:

PCIe Express is physically and electrically incompatible with PCI

EDIT:

I think you mixed it up with PCI-X:

PCI-X is generally backward compatible with PCI, meaning that you can, for example, install a PCI card that is keyed to allow 3.3V operation in a PCI-X slot

Is that what you read ? If so, you should've read the entire article, including the paragraph "Confusion with PCI-Express"

PCI-E and PCI-X are different interfaces.

RJ

[juppy]

I thought maybe the confusion came from this other statement in that Wikipedia article, RJ. The one that said:

It was designed to be software compatible with the preexisting PCI standard, making the conversion of PCI cards and systems to PCI Express as simple as replacing the physical layer without requiring a change to the supporting software.

That quote was saying it was *software* compatible. I thought maybe that was taken as everything being compatible. Whatever the reason though, no, it won't work.

[Endless Pain]

Thanks a lot, guys! I just have one other question; where can I find either a sound card, an A/V capture card, or a wireless network card that fits in a PCI Express X1 slot?(I couldn't find any on the web.)

[RJ]

where can I find either a sound card, an A/V capture card, or a wireless network card that fits in a PCI Express X1 slot?

AFAIK, there are no sound cards for PCI-e yet, unfortunately. Creative has announced PCI-e versions of the X-Fi series, but they haven't been released yet. Maybe they'll come later this year, but that's just speculation.
Also, ASUS announced its Xonar sound card, it'll be available for PCI and PCI-e. But the release date is not known yet.

WLAN card for PCI-e: Abit AirPace Wi-Fi.

AV capture cards: Canopus EDIUS NX PCI-e, Blackmagic Design DeckLink Extreme PCIe (yeah, expensive, but PCI-e )
... or in combination with a graphics chip: ATI AIW for PCI-e.
TV cards can also serve for AV grabbing, if they have AV jacks. The one from Terratec is PCI-e but does not have AV inputs.
But there is LifeView's FlyTV Express X1 series, they have AV inputs and are for PCI-e.
Also, according to Hauppauge their WinTV-HVR-1700 is due out in summer this year.

Yeah, there are barely no PCI-e products availalbe for this kind of stuff. Most PCI-e x1 devices right now are controller cards (to add more SATA ports), firewire and USB cards.
But new PCI-e x1 cards are coming ... slowly but surely

RJ

[glc]

Doesn't your onboard sound work?

You can use a USB capture device if you have to.

Here's the Abit wifi card:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16833347001

[Endless Pain]

That answers a lot! So I guess I was wrong in thinking that those retail computers' boards are useless; they're just set up for the future. Thanks again!