New computer freezing

[kaluapig]

Building a new computer with Win98se and it's freezing.

First problem: unable to load Win98se OS as the computer kept freezing on a setup screen.

First problem solved: by loading the OS on my HDD using another computer, then reinstalling my HDD back into the new computer.

Current problem: Computer freezing before it reaches the Win98se desktop.

The computer detects an unknown device and tries to find software for it....This is where it freezes.

Another time, I got a blue screen "A fatal exception 0E has occured at 0167:BFF72170 Current application will be terminated"...this came after a scandisk due to improper shutdown form the problem before.

I have been given some advice that my problem may be RAM or overheating problems. As far as the RAM goes, its DDR and the system does recognize it in the POST memory check. As far as the overheating problems, the computer is on no more than 30 seconds before it freezes up. The CPU cooling baffles is at most warm to touch.

Any help from the Yoda's out there is much appreciated. This patowan is now missing hair.

Thanks all.

[Cricket]

Hi kaluapig,

The problem sounds either like bad RAM or an overheating CPU.

The RAM check up at start up is only to see how much RAM is available to the system, it doesn't do an actual test on the RAM to check for errors. You can do a simple RAM test by trying to boot to Safe Mode. Hold the Shift key during boot up and the RAM will be tested prior to entering Safe Mode by Himem.sys. If the RAM checks out, you'll enter Safe Mode. If there is a problem with the RAM, you'll get an error message.

Or you can check the RAM out with Doc Memory or with Memtest86.

You should also make sure that the heatsink is making good solid contact with the CPU core. Make sure that the heatsink fan is working too. Is the heatsink fan connected to the motherboard or to one of the power supply power leads? If the fan is one of those 6500 to 7000 RPM fans it may require more power than the motherboard fan header can supply, could be causing the motherboard to shutdown.

Is the RAM and video card installed properly.

Does your case have case fans?

Have you tried running your system with the case open?

What are your system specs? Provide make and model of all parts.

Link to previous problem

Cricket

[mike breck]

Hi kaluapig,

I agree with Cricket. The first suspects would be flaky Ram or an overheating CPU.

The Temps.

Go into the BIOS and you will find a section where you can see your CPU, perhaps CPU fan speed, and mobo temp.

Make a note of the temps when you first start and then leave it running for about 30mins.

Tell us what the temps are.

P.S. If this is an AMD CPU and the CPU temp hits 60c and continues to rise, then switch it off immediately.

The Ram.

You can use the programs that Cricket suggested. Also, if you have more than one stick of Ram in the system, then try with one stick and then the other. Just on case one is flaky.

Come back with your temps and more info about your system.

[kaluapig]

Thank you Cricket and Mike,

I will go and test the memory. If thats not it, I'll get the CPU temps for your review.

To answer Crickets questions:
The CPU fan is connected to the motherboard. The fan and heat sink was a package deal with the motherboard so I can't tell if it is running at 6.5K-7K RPM.

AGP video card installed properly (I hope)...Did not get any POST errors on it....did not see any deficiencies in the video quality.

Case has two fans. But I am currently running it with the ATX case open.

Here are the specs:
- Shuttle AK31 266MHz DDR Socket A Motherboard
- AMD Athlon XP 1900+ Processor**
- Speeze Socket A/370 Cooling Fan
- PNY 256MB PC2100 DDR Memory (266MHz)
- Wester Digital 7200 20GB HDD
- Win98se


Hope this helps in my dillema.

And once again thanks for all of your help.

Nick

[RobH]

Looks like a pretty decent system to me,what video card are you running?
I ran into a problem on my last build,it was a asus A7A board with a ATI video card,caused headaches until I looked around a bit and seen posts where others had the same problem.I tried a different video card,and took care of it.
You might also try the steps of trouble shooting ,by Hal
http://forum.pcmech.com/showthread.php?threadid=12753

[kaluapig]

My video card is an older ATI video card....hmmmmmm.

Will still press on checking RAM and CPU temps. If all check well, will be looking into that video card.

Anymore advice is greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Nick

[mike breck]

It could also be that your the hardware detection is OK, but a device driver or a device incorrectly identified by Windows is causing the problem.

Hold the Shift key when booting to go into Safe Mode. Look in Device Manager for a flagged device and then "Remove" it.
Also remove any "ghost" devices you see there e.g. extra listings for any device. There should be only one.

Restart the PC and see whether Windows can identify and install it correctly. It may even forget about it.

If you can boot into Safe Mode and shutdown the PC from Safe Mode, that usually implies that Windows is having trouble with a device driver. On the other hand, if the problem still persists in Safe Mode, the chances are it is a hardware problem or overheating.

HTH

[kaluapig]

ONE WORD - ERRRRAAAAATIC!!!

Temperature goes as follows
1st minute - 25C
3rd minute - 35C
6th minute - 50C
12th minute - 55C
20th minute - 56C
20th++ remaines consistant 56C

CPU Fan RPM 4100RPM +/- about 50

Power supply
+3.3V ....actual 3.2V
+5V ....actual 4.83V
rest is right on the money

Step by step confirmation
1. ***Himem.sys /Testmem:On = checks good
2. loads GUI and freezes either when a dialog box comes up about not having a mouse. Or when I attach a mouse, it freezes on a Display Properties box (don't know why it pops up in the first place).

***(ref Himem.sys) there was a time when the CPU was running at 55C that it kept on stalling on this memory test. After I tried to boot up using the same technique 2 times, the computer would freeze at the Scan Disk function. A few times after that, it would freeze on the "choose a booting technique" screen (Normal Safe Mode Step by Step). I let it the computer cool down for 5 minutes, tried to boot up and all was "normal" (freezing at the usual spots).

CPU TEMP
checked that the fan was properly mounted to the Processor, and it was. The heat transfer goop was confirmed gooped onto he processor.

However, after re-attaching the fan, the computer would not display the video adapter on-screen...it seemed to be frozen in post with no audible tones. I took out the DDR and reinstalled it which seemed to fix the problem. Is that erratic or what!

Another erratic thing this computer does is, SOMETIMES, the post does not display the CPU, Memory amount and DRAM clock before trying to boot the GUI. Just goes straight into it.

On on of my last attempts at booting up, I got a Blue screen (trying to boot in Safe Mode) stating:
VFAT Device initialization Failed,
Device or resource requireed by VFAT is not present or is unavailable.

THIS IS WHERE I THREW IN THE TOWEL.

Your advice more and more, very very much appreciate by the second.

Thanks so much
Nick

[Cricket]

Hi kaluapig,

Are you taking the motherboard out of the case and placing it on a hard flat surface when you remove or install the heatsink? It's a good idea to have the motherboard on a hard flat surface to support it and keep it from bending too much when working with the HSF, video card or RAM. Too much bending can cause the solder joint on the motherboard to crack, or the circuit traces on the motherboard can also crack.

I would still test the RAM with Doc Memory or MemTest86, just to be sure.

I never heard of Speeze heatsinks...do they get good review? Is it fairly large or does it just cover the CPU socket without too much overhang. It could be too small for your CPU and unable to cool it properly. Having too much thermal compound can prevent good thermal transfer. You only need a very little amount for it to work properly.

Do you have a good quality power supply? Or is it a generic one in a cheap case? If it's a DEER brand power supply, consider replacing it ASAP...those are very poor quality and can damage your other components if it dies.

Cricket

[kaluapig]

As far as the speeze heatsink and power supply, I fear it is probably of a generic model because #1 the fan came packaged with the motherboard and #2 the powersupply is only a 300W.

On the lighter side of things, the fan and heat sink are pretty hefty as it overhangs the cpu quite a bit. The noise of this fan, good or bad, sounds like a GE jet engine spooling up.

Do you think the temps I show above are within limits?

Tell, you what I'm going to do is go down to the computer store and buy more memory and a new video card.....The video card I'm using has been canibalized from another workstation that I must give back at some point in time.

Thanks much.....will let you know what the verdict is.

Nick

[mrjohnsonjr]

those temps are way too high... is the heatsink level and sitting flat on the processor???

[Cricket]

Hi kaluapig,

Your CPU temps are pretty high. With a good heatsink, you should see idle temps in the 40's.

I just checked out some reviews on some Speeze heatsinks and they said the fan used is sort of pathetic. That might explain why the CPU temps kept rising. Maybe you could replace the existing fan with one that moves more air.

I just read through this thread and noticed that you installed Win98 on another PC and then moved it to this one. You might want to try using the ENUM trick, it might help clear up some issues.

The ENUM Trick

Another thing, are your IDE cables installed properly and the drives jumpered correctly? With ATA66/100/133 80 wire IDE cables, you put the blue connector in the motherboard, the black end connector goes to the master hard drive and the grey middle connector goes to the slave drive. Drives are jumpered CS (cable select).

The optical drives (CD-ROM, CD-RW, DVD) usually use the older ATA33 40 wire IDE cable and the drives are jumpered to master or slave.

Are the drives recognized properly in BIOS?

Cricket

[kaluapig]

Its the problem child again,

Well, it wasn't the RAM: Swapped out the old chip with a new one and still the same problem.

It wasn't the Video Card: Swapped out the old video card with a new one.

Only components left is the Motherboard and the Processor....UUUGH, now comes the long process of trying to return Mr. Defecto.

To all,
Will update this thread as soon as I try out a new board & chip. I have learned much from y'all and appreciate your help immensely. Thank you all for your time, support and wisdom.

MAAAHALO,
Nick

[kaluapig]

Well all,

Got a new M/B and CPU and it works just fine. Makes me wonder what was the problem though (CPU or M/B or both).

I do appreciate all of your support and I thank you ALL most graciously.

See ya

Nick

[Cricket]

Hi kaluapig,

Thanks for coming back and letting us know how you're doing. Too bad about the motherboard and CPU...it happens.

With a user name like that, are you from Hawaii?

Cricket

[kaluapig]

I am indeed from Hawaii and it looks like you are too. Once again, thanks so much for your help.

BTW what is your profession?

Nick
res0mjm8@verizon.net