P4 Northwood/Chipset FAQ

[Floppyman]

Hi all,

To help some of the users out I thought I'd write this little FAQ.

What's the difference between the original P4 (Willamette) and the P4 Northwood?

To put in simple terms, the original Pentium 4 is based on the .18 micron process and has 256k L2 cache. It is available in both 423pin and 478pin configurations. The Pentium 4 "Northwood" is based on the .13 micron process and comes with 512k L2 cache. It is only available in the 478pin configuration.

How can I tell the difference between a Pentium 4 and Pentium 4 Northwood when buying one?

Besides what's listed above, the Pentium 4 Northwoods have have either an "A" behind listed behind them, meaning it's a Northwood Pentium 4 and it's running at 400fsb, or a "B", meaning it's a Pentium 4 Northwood running at the 533mhz FSB.

I currently have a motherboard with an original 423 pin Pentium 4. Can I upgrade to a Pentium 4 Northwood without buying a new board?

There are some 423 to 478 pin converters out there, but I have not had experience with any. You might be better off buying a new board in the long run.

Can I run a Pentium 4 Northwood on my motherboard if I currently have 478 original Pentium 4 running on it?

Doublecheck with your motherboard manufacturer, but yes you should be able to.

What chipsets are currently available for the Pentium 4 and Pentium 4 Northwood?

The chipsets are available currently are:

Older chipsets:

Intel 845D - officially supports 400mhz FSB and pc1600/2100 DDR ram
Intel 850 - officially supports 400mhz FSB and pc-800 RDRAM
SIS 645- officially supports 400/533mhz FSB and pc-1600/2100/2700 DDR ram.

Newer chipsets:

Intel 845E- officially supports 400/533mhz FSB and pc-1600/2100 DDR ram
Intel 850E- officially supports 400/533mhz FSB and pc-800 RDRAM. I'm not quite sure whether pc-1066 is "officially" supported.
Intel 845G- officially supports 400/533mhz FSB and pc-1600/2100/2700 DDR ram. Boards based on this chipset have audio and video onboard.

I've heard the Northwood Pentium 4 is quite overclockable. Is there any truth to this?

Yes. The 1.6ghz and 1.8ghz Northwood Pentium 4's (both are 400mhz FSB, 100mhz system bus) easily overclock to the 133mhz bus (533mhz FSB) without alot of trouble, making them run at 2.133 and 2.4ghz respectively. Other Pentium 4 Northwood's overclock as well, for more details on speeds people are getting check out the CPU database at www.overclockers.com

I'm planning on overclocking my Pentium 4 Northwood. What should I keep in mind?

Just as with any type of overclocking there's a certain amount of risk involved and there are no guarantee's you'll hit the speed you wished for. Make sure you watch the temps of your cpu in the bios. Also make sure your AGP and PCI busses stay in spec, 66 and 33mhz respectively. As for the top end voltage don't go any higher 1.7v (1.5v is the default voltage of the Pentium 4 Northwood's). I consider 1.7v to be the top end, keeping your chip 1.65v or lower would be much better. If you go to high on the voltage you are at risk of frying its (the CPU's) interconnects. Lastly, make sure you have the right ram for your overclock, in other words make sure the ram candle the overclock.

I'm ready to overclock. How am I able to overclock my Pentium 4 Northwood?

Just like other Intel cpu's the Pentium 4 Northwood is multiplier locked, so you can only increase your FSB.

Does it make sense of going with RDRAM 850E based motherboard over DDR?

Unless you need to have a lot of memory bandwidth, DDR Memory will work just fine, and is also cheaper.

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These are some of the questions I can think of for now. Feel free to add on down below, or to correct me (I'm sure I made some mistakes).

I was thinking we could also add on a kind of P4 and Pentium 4 Northwood motherboard database in this thread, in where we (Pentium 4 Willamette and Pentium 4 Northwood users)list:

What board you are using:
What CPU (P4 Willamette or P4 Northwood and default speed):
What ram:
Are you overclocking (yes/no-- even if you aren't overclocking please fill out the next 5 questions)
What speed is your CPU running at:
What speed is your ram running at:
Your ram settings:
What voltage is your CPU running at:
What temperature is CPU running at:
How did you overclock (list what settings you switched for your particular board) that enabled you to overclock:

This should help make it easier for users to who are planning to overclock, by showing what settings to switch, what their cpu might be capable off...etc.


Hope this FAQ helps someone out and once again feel free to addon/correct me.

UPDATES:

8/28/02

Update to reflect pin converters.

[HAL9000]

Handy little FAQ Floppydude... good work.

[Floppyman]

You overclocking Hal? (can't quite remember) If you don't mind could you add your config below (even it's just a regular P4) as I described it above? Be nice for someone to "break the ice". TIA.

[HAL9000]

I have tried mine and ran it for a while just to see if it would stay stable. Mine is a 1.7Ghz Willamette on an AOpen AX-45. I set the soft menu to 133Mhz x 4 and voila... and instant 2261Mhz. I currently have it running at the stock 1700Mhz as I see no need to up it... just tried it to see if I could.

[Nuclear Krusader]

This thread could be Hall of Fame material, I think.

If I overclock a P4, how much will its life be decreased?

[smokealotapotimus]

I always thought that PC2700 support was kind of unofficial for the i845G?

Also, looking on PriceWatch shows some pin converters for P4's.

[HAL9000]

yea.. there are 423 to 478 convertors... but I really don't know if it will be worth it.

[Floppyman]

I'll keep this thread going.

What board you are using: Asus P4B533 (845E chipset)
What CPU (P4 Willamette or P4 Northwood and default speed): 1.8ghz Northwood
What ram: 1gig Mushkin pc2100 DDR ram
Are you overclocking (yes/no-- even if you aren't overclockingplease fill out the next 5 questions) YES
What speed is your CPU running at: 2.4ghz (18x133)
What speed is your ram running at: 266mhz (133mhz DDR)
What voltage is your CPU running at: 1.6v
What temperature is CPU running at: Anywhere from about 34 C to about 50C when running Prime95 (full cpu load)
How did you overclock (list what settings you switched for your particular board) that enabled you to overclock:

Under the advanced section in the bios, I set:

CPU Vcore: 1.6v
CPU External Frequency: 133mhz
CPU/Memory Ratio: 1:1 (since I'm using pc2100 DDR ram)

If you are running a Pentium 4 Willametteor Pentium 4 Northwood, please take a couple minutes and add your setup download below as well. Thank you.

P.S. I was going to edit and get rid of the Ram settings question, but I can't edit my post anymore. Consider it optional.

[Werewolfdaddy]

What board you are using: Intel 850mvl
What CPU (P4 Willamette or P4 Northwood and default speed): 1.6a northwood
What ram: 512mb pc800 ramus
Are you overclocking (yes/no-- even if you aren't overclocking please fill out the next 5 questions) no, this motherboard can't be overclocked
What speed is your CPU running at: 1.6gig
What speed is your ram running at: 400mhz
I have to run right now; I'll finish the other questions later.

[Floppyman]

^bump^ Let's keep this going...

[not important]

Isn't there also a Brookdale P4 ?

[Floppyman]

^bump^

[rogerstaples]

What board you are using: Gigabyte 8IRXP (intel 845)
What CPU (P4 Willamette or P4 Northwood and default speed): 1.8ghz Northwood
What ram: 256Mb DDR memory (not sure what make)
Are you overclocking (yes/no-- even if you aren't overclockingplease fill out the next 5 questions) Not yet
What speed is your CPU running at: 1.8 Ghz
What speed is your ram running at: 266mhz (133mhz DDR)
What voltage is your CPU running at: 1.5v
What temperature is CPU running at: Anywhere from about 32 C to about 46C when running speedfan(full cpu load)


slyder

[AcidJazz]

Originally posted by Nuclear Krusader If I overclock a P4, how much will its life be decreased?

I'd like to know this as well...

[nlawalker]

I've got a couple Intel questions:

1. You mentioned the Intel chipsets for P4's... what about other chipsets, like VIA's? I can't make sense between all of them.

2. Also, on socket 478 mobos, what's that big black bracket around the socket? Is it for a HSF?

Nick

edit: Also, Intel's site says the 845G supports AGP 4X. Isn't 8X supposed to be out soon/now?

[glc]

1. Via has chipsets for the P4, but I wouldn't touch them with a 10 foot pole. The other player in the game is SiS, who (unlike Via) actually bought a license from Intel and is putting out a good product.

2. Yes, that's the heatsink retention bracket. It's far superior to those that clip on the socket ears.

The only 8X AGP chipset so far for the P4 is the SiS 648. If Via has one, I don't know about it and don't care anyway. Intel should be following suit soon.

[nlawalker]

Thanks for the answer. Why are Via's chipsets so bad? They seem to be industry standard for Athlons. Why would P4's be different (I mean just in terms of making a good product, not circuitry-wise)?

[glc]

Let's put it this way - you just don't know what stability is till you have built with an Intel chipset. I'm not going to paraphrase in this thread what has been said in many threads on this forum, but I just don't think Via makes a quality chipset for ANY platform. They are price-driven, not quality or performance driven.

[SDWhite]

Sorry. Double post.

[SDWhite]

What board you are using: ABIT TH7II- RAID
What CPU (P4 Willamette or P4 Northwood and default speed): 1.8A Northwood
What ram: Kingston PC-800
Are you overclocking (yes/no-- even if you aren't overclocking please fill out the next 5 questions) Yes
What speed is your CPU running at: 2.1Ghz
What speed is your ram running at: 415 (830)
Your ram settings:
What voltage is your CPU running at: 1.45
What temperature is CPU running at: 35-45
How did you overclock (list what settings you switched for your particular board) that enabled you to overclock: FSB in BIOS

Probably could get higher. Scared to fry CPU.

[Floppyman]

Any more people out there with P4 setups that could be added to this list?

[lil Jimmie]

What board you are using: Asus P4S533 (SiS 645)
What CPU (P4 Willamette or P4 Northwood and default speed): 2.4B
What ram: 512Mb Kingston PC2700
Are you overclocking (yes/no-- even if you aren't overclockingplease fill out the next 5 questions) YES and No
What speed is your CPU running at: 2.4 currently have gone to 2.88
What speed is your ram running at: 333mhz
What voltage is your CPU running at: 1.6v
What temperature is CPU running at: 34C at idle to 47C when at full load
How did you overclock (list what settings you switched for your particular board) that enabled you to overclock: Change the FSB to 18X160 = 2.88Ghz

[Jake Kantonen]

Hey! I am brand new to this site, and I can't wait to get started...

I just started building my very first personal computer (I'm a senior in high school) and am very excited about it. I hope that this board and you guys will be able to help me with problems along the way

Anyway, here's my answers:

What board you are using: Asus P4S8X
What CPU (P4 Willamette or P4 Northwood and default speed): P4 Northwood-2.53 GHz, 533 FSB
What ram: 512 MB PC2700 DDR SDRAM (hope to get another couple sticks of 512 when I get the money)
Are you overclocking (yes/no-- even if you aren't overclocking please fill out the next 5 questions) No, I don't know how yet
What speed is your CPU running at: 2.53 GHz
What speed is your ram running at: 333 MHz, I think, does that sound right?
Your ram settings: ?
What voltage is your CPU running at: ?
What temperature is CPU running at: Never checked
How did you overclock (list what settings you switched for your particular board) that enabled you to overclock: I didn't overclock.

Hopefully I will learn how to overclock soon, but not until I finish building my computer.

Jake

[glc]

If you already have a 533 FSB processor, overclocking it can be a bit tough.

[lil Jimmie]

I am by no means an expert on OC'ing and Glc has made a good point about the 533 bus speed of the cpu, but I think it also depends on the quality of ram when you go to increase the front side bus speeds. I have heard from other users of the P4SX8 that it's not as good of an OC'r as the P4S533.

[Floppyman]

Just to draw a comparision, it was the same situation back then with the "E" and "EB" PIII's. For example a PIII 600E was usually easier to overclock than a 600EB (133mhz bus). Although from what I've seen people are getting decent speeds from the 533mhz P4's as well.

[Floppyman]

Intel's coming out with new chipsets:

845PE- supports 533mhz and pc2700 (333mhz) DDR ram, AGP4x

845GE- supports 533mhz bus and pc2700 (333mhz) DDR ram, integrated graphics, AGP 4x

845GV-supports 533mhz bus and pc2100 (266mhz) DDR ram, integrated graphics, AGP 4x, no AGP slot.

Check out this article for more details at Anandtech

[Toaster]

Hi folks!
The use of an adaptor to adapt "up" a 423 to the 478 is FAR from ideal and should be avoided wherever possible. While my first hand experiences are limited to 2 installations, both were problematic and BIOS support was happhazzard.
Bottom line:
The adaptor(s) and BIOS issues could make the installations costly and problematic. Newer system boards offer both compatability and performance gains that far outweigh any savings.

ADMIN:
My silence hath broken, see the ADMIN forum for details.

[Jay32]

I've finished my new P4 build and had a chance to play with it a little. Here's what I've got so far:

What board you are using: Asus P4S533
What CPU (P4 Willamette or P4 Northwood and default speed): 2.0A
What ram: Kingston 512 MB PC2700 DDR SDRAM
Are you overclocking (yes/no-- even if you aren't overclocking please fill out the next 5 questions) Yes
What speed is your CPU running at: 2.66 GHz
What speed is your ram running at: 333 MHz
Your ram settings: By SPD (Default)
What voltage is your CPU running at: 1.65
What temperature is CPU running at: 30-45C (Idle to Load)
How did you overclock (list what settings you switched for your particular board) that enabled you to overclock: FSB to 133 and V to 1.65- Stable so far, will go for more soon(hope to get 2.8)!
PSU: Enermax 431W
Cooling: Vantec 80mm front and back, Enermax 120mm intake side mounted over CPU & video, dual fan PSU exhaust

[aym]

What board you are using: Intel 850E
What CPU (P4 Willamette or P4 Northwood and default speed): 2.4b
What ram: 256MB (128 x 2) RDRAM 800MHz (I'll buy more later)
Are you overclocking: No (Mobo isn't overclockable, and why should I overclock a 2.4GHz CPU??)
What speed is your CPU running at: 2.4 GHz
What speed is your ram running at: 800 MHz
What voltage is your CPU running at: CPU Core 1.471 V
What temperature is CPU running at: 37 -> 48 C
How did you overclock (list what settings you switched for your particular board) that enabled you to overclock: -