Geforce 2 mx400 64mb AGP

[southrk]

I am having a problem, in any game that i play, nascar 4, madden 2002 etc, the edges of everything are jagged. i have the latest direct x drivers, and the latest detonator drivers. on my old video card (geforce 2 mx 200 32mb agp) nothing was jagged, it was all smooth. any help would be appreciated.

[mike breck]

Hi Southrk,

Have you tried adjusting the settings for the Geoforce in Display Properties?

[southrk]

what would i have to change? they are all at the default mode

[mike breck]

Well for starters, you could try playing around with the different settings in Direct3D Midmap detail level. The settings range from best performance to best image quality. I have mine at "blend" but a different setting might be better for you.

If not already ticked, tick the boxes for Z buffer, enable alternate depth..etc

Try playing around with the OpenGl settings as well.

If that fails, and you cannot stand the the image quality, then you can always try reverting to the previous set of Det drivers that worked fine.

At least that would tell you if it's the drivers or the card.

Different sets of Det drivers seem to work better, worse, or not at all with different games.

HTH

BTW I'm running the 12.41 Dets on all my systems and they work fine with a TNT2 Ultra, Geoforce 256, and Geoforce 2mx.

[southrk]

Well, i just installed windows xp and installed the xp drivers from ndivia and i am having the same problems.

[mike breck]

Have you tried the most recent AGP driver from your mobo manufacturer?
If it's a Via chipset then try the latest 4in1 drivers.

I assume it's a fairly new mobo? Older mobos can have problems supplying enough power to the Geoforce 2. This usually results in lockups or crashes.

[kohlhk80]

I had this same problem.

You need to download the new detonator drivers. Besides the 50% increase in speed that they provide, they should also fix your problem.

then go to display properties. then to geforce properties.

Restore all the opengl and direct 3d settings to default.
That worked for me.

[southrk]

i have the latest detonator drivers, i got them for xp. I have a ep-8k7a mobo, ive tried reinstalling everything, changing everything to default and none of that changes it.

[southrk]

I just tried to install the new 4 in 1 drivers, and it keeps saying cannot find the software to install the drivers, are theses compatible with xp?

[Tiretool]

VIA 4 in 1 drivers are required by any motherboard with a VIA chipset, so let's hope Bill didn't make XP intolerable to the drivers.

Are you sure you're unzipping your 4 in 1 drivers to the same folder windows is looking for them in? Ideally, you should install WinXP, then the 4 in 1 drivers, then all the device drivers. If your card still acts weird after you successfully install the VIA 4 in 1 drivers, you should probably look at exchanging the card. Also, make sure you're using the right monitor drivers, and not the generic plug and pray drivers for it.

[southrk]

Now im getting frustrated, lol. I have tried all your suggestions, ive enen tried a new video card, and i still get the same jagged edges. Even straight lines are jagged.

[mike breck]

Try running Dxdiag in the Direct X folder. Does the card pass all the tests?

Are you getting jagged edges in the Dxdiag tests?
Are these jagged edges showing up anywhere else apart from your games?

I would try reinstalling your DX version again. Just run the installation program and it will overwrite the existing DX drivers. It is usually a good idea to do this if you update video drivers.

Other ideas: Try a different monitor. Try using the specific drivers for your monitor.

BTW I'm haven't got the games you mentioned but is this happening in
in UT or Quake3? These are benchmark games to test any graphics card on.
It's a long shot, but if this was just happening in the two games
you mentioned, it could be that both of them needed a patch.

[southrk]

i dont have ut or quake 3, i ran all the tests, they all passed, but in the test where the boxes spin the edges of them are all jagged. Ive tried reinstalling direct x8, the detonator 3 drivers for xp, the via 4 in 1 drivers, iver even tried reformatting and starting from scratch, ive tried a new video card, ive tried using my monitor drivers instead of plug and play. ive tried almost everything. I Have a 1.4 ghz athlon thunderbird on an EP-8k7a mobo with 256 mg ddram, geforce2 mx-400 64mb, 60g maxtor 7200rpm hd, kenwood true x 52x cd, creative 8x4x32 cdrw, sound blaster pci128, and the graphics look better on my old pentium III 450, 128 mg ram, geforce 2 mx 200 32mb, creative 32x cd. Im almost ready to throw my computer out the window, i get good frame rates, everything is just jagged, majorly.

[mike breck]

Yes,

I'd be frustrated too. It's what I call a process of tedious elimination.

If there is a card in the PCI slot next to the AGP slot, remove it as it shares resources with the AGP slot. Run DX diag again.


Is Anti-Aliaing enabled in Display Properties-Settings-Geoforce-Additional Properties"? If it isn't enable it. If it is enabled, try increasing the slider or settings. Anti-Aliasing is suppose to have the job of smoothing the edges of displayed images. I've never found it to have much effect on my systems but it's worth a try.

Some Bios Tweaks. Try one thing at a time and check results.

Check in Bios that the "Init Display First" or "Primary VGA Bios" is set to "AGP" and not PCI.

AGP Sidebanding - "enable" if present
AGP Fast Writes - " " "
Video Bios Cache - disable
Video Bios Shadow - disable
PCI/VGA - "disable" if present

Try adjusting the "AGP Aperture Size" in the bios. Usually the default is 64mb. Try 128mb, 256mb and 32mb. Changing the size can allow some games to run better and some worse. So you need a flexible approach depending on the game. In this case, see if it improves your graphics. However, don't put it any lower than 32, as that turns off AGP.

Check the "AGP Capabilty" (it may be listed differently on yours)in the Bios. If your card supports 4x mode, then changed it to 4x.
Also, I seem to remember reading somewhere, that for some cards, when installing the AGP driver in the 4in1 drivers you should install it in "Turbo" mode. If you don't, then you are running the card in AGP 1x. I don't think this will solve your "edge" problem, but it's worth checking on your card manufacturers site. Epox also have a registry tweak to enable 4x.

Try changing the colour depths and resolutions e.g. does the problem still occur at say 800x600 @ 16bit colour. Experiment with all the combinations and see what effect these changes have. You may at present, be pushing the card to the limits and suffering some graphical abnormalities in return. Some have reported graphic corruption problems running at high resolutions and 32 bit colour even with a Geoforce 64mb card.

Depending on what components are in your case, the card may not be receiving enough power. Try disconnecting all power cables apart from the mobo.
See if that affects the situation. If it does, you may have to upgrade the power supply.

I think you should still try to eliminate the monitor as an improbable cause. Borrow and try a different monitor. Borrow and try a different monitor cable. Just so you can eliminate these components.

In Display Properties-Settings-Advanced-Adapter is the refresh rate set to "Optimal"? This is the setting I use for all my Nvidia cards.
If it is set to Optimal then try "Adapter Default".
If that doesn't work, you may also want to check the maximum recommended refresh rate for your monitor and try setting that refresh rate in the drop-down list.


Strip the system down in the case to mobo, ram, video card, hard drive, mouse, and keyboard. Try running DX diag again. Is the problem still there? If not, then a PCI card (eg Sounblaster)could be conflicting with the AGP card.



If nothing works then give us some additional info:

What OS were you using before upgrading to XP?
Please clarify: Did this problem occur before you upgraded to XP?
What DX version were you using with the old card (that worked) and with the new one?
Which card graphic card is it (make and model)?

Was the second, new card you tried exactly the same make and model as the original or was it different?
If it was the same, try your old card, or borrow a different Nvidia card, and see if it's still happening. It may be that, for whatever reason, the make of card plus drivers does not work well with your current system.

I'm throwing ideas at you in the hope that something works. These are the things I would try myself. Sorry I can't be more helpful and give you an exact solution.

[Tiretool]

Thorough, solid advice mike, good to have you around!

Southrk, keep in mind that if you enable FSAA (Full screen anti-aliasing) you are going to suffer significant performance hits with an MX Geforce card.

[southrk]

ok, i have tried changing the bios settings, didnt do a thing, ive tried different monitors/cables, same thing. when i turn anti aliasing to x4 it just makes it worse, i have it set to "allow applications to control the antialiasing mode". ive tried 800x600 16 bit color mode. ive tried stripping my mobo. ive tried chanign my refresh rate, it is currently at 85 mhz, there is no "optized" in the list, its from 60-100 mhz, 100 makes the screen look really wierd. I have nothing in the 3 pci slots under the agp

I just built this system from scratch, fresh install of xp, no operating system used before it. I also tried a geforce2 mx 200 32 meg, and it did the same thing. I am now using the ABIT siluro geforce2 mx 400 64 meg.

[Tiretool]

You said this problem didn't exist on your old motherboard with the Pentium 450, this may boil down to an incompatability issue with the new motherboard. I guess anything's possible. Have you tried this video card on any other motherboards (other than the P 450 board)? If you don't have any other motherboards to test it on, take the video card to a local computer shop and see if they get similar results on any of their motherboards. Stay there and visually determine whether they are seeing the same jaggies that you are at home. If they are not, the obvious answer is the motherboard has a problem or is incompatible with that card. I was unable to find anything on incompatabilities with that card on EPOX's web page, and in fact I can't remember hearing of any incompatabilities in any of the recent reviews of that motherboard using an NVidia card. If you aren't prepared to return the motherboard or the video card just yet, try the above mentioned suggestions. I hope you find a fix for your problem.

[mike breck]

Thanks Tiretool. This is an unsual problem and like you I haven't come across it before.

However, I don't think it's the Abit Siluro, as you have tried the old Geoforce in the Epox mobo and that was showing the same graphic fault.

So, it could be a fault with the mobo e.g. faulty AGP slot.

Of course the other unkown factor here is Windows XP. This is new and I am sure, as with previous MS OS's we are going to find lots of bugs and incompatibilty problems. In a way, it is unfortunate you changed OS, as this is also muddying the waters in trying to find a solution.

What I think you should do (and you're going to hate me for this) is reformat and load your previous OS and see if the old card and new card work perfectly. Remember to load your OS, then 4in1 drivers (AGP in Turbo mode), then graphics drivers - in that order.

If the fault is not there, then XP is the problem and you will need to wait for a patch or service pack which will hopefully solve the problem.

I know it's a lot of hassle, but anyone who is a member of this Forum lives for this sort of PC hassle. We love hassle here at PC Mechanic! We all learn a great deal when something goes wrong. So consider this a challenge, rather than a chore, which is contributing to your computer knowledge.

Plus, it will keep other members advised of potential XP problems with hardware. If you just exchange the mobo or card for different brands then we will miss a good opportunity to troubleshoot this problem a bit more.

If changing OS doesn't work, then as Tiretool advised, have the card and the mobo tested by a local, reputable shop. At least, then, you can pat yourself on the back for trying everything you could to solve the problem yourself.

[southrk]

ok, i spent 2 hours this morning remormatting and putting 98 back on. I installed everything in the order you said. still jagged lines

[mike breck]

Sorry to hear that Southrk.

I read your other post about the peculiar noise coming from somewhere. You're not having an easy build.

Unless someone comes up with a better idea, I think the time has come to have the card and mobo checked. If you bought locally, then have them check. If you bought mail order, you can still have the local guy check them, tell you what's wrong, so you can inform the retailer.

However, it may be the local guy can come up with a solution.

If you are able to exchange them, then it may be better going for a different card/mobo combination second time round. You don't want to get exactly the same part and then find the problem still exists. Go to Epox and check which other video cards they recommend.

HTH

Mike.

[Hpro]

Do you know someone who is using AMD processor where you live - ask them to let you borrow the CPU for an hour or two - this including you sound problem looks to me like a faulty CPU - which can't handle the 3D-NOW I did made a post in this matter in the general forum a while back - may this helps..

[southrk]

The problem is, i have checked around to the computer shops around here, and most of them want $50-80 to even look at it, i cant afford that, building this computer has dwindled my checking account down to about $20. I had the chair of the computer science department here look at it, he couldnt figure it out, and a couple other professors, and they couldnt figure it out.

[Hpro]

I just responded to your post on the ----- SOUND problem --- follow the link there which I posted and download the utility and test the cpu for free.! you can do this on your own - if you have any questions I can assure you that here everyone is willing to help you...I also just responded to your email...

[southrk]

ok, I looked at the jpg/gif test, and both appeared identical.

i couldnt find anything to download, so i assume you mean the test on the page asking if the jpg and gif pictures look the same?

Thank you everyone for your help and support on these 2 posts, i hope i get t his fixed soon

[southrk]

Here is a picture of the jagged lines i was talking about. This is a screenshot from madden2002

[southrk]

here is another picture, this one from nascar 4

[Hpro]

OK I got what you mean . Hold on here it's about 2AM and 8AM I will call some of my friends - gamers to ask them what they think about this..so hold on there.

You could do this - http://www.madonion.com and download 3Dmark2001 and run it -let me know what kind of - statement you got about -hardware not supportet. It's a kind a huge file..20mb or so..

[mike breck]

Well I had a look at both pictures and while the slight jagged edges are irritating, at least you can still use the computer and game until some one comes up with an answer.

If that's the price stores are charging you'd be better to wait until you had some money and buying a cheap little Duron 600 to test Hpro's theory. At least you'd be left with a spare CPU for diagnostic work in the future.

As you don't have much money, have you contacted the retailer you bought the goods from? Can you send the parts back and exchange them for different makes?

Some people on these forums don't seem to have a problem changing parts with online retailers.

I'm not saying you should do it immediately, but it would be wise to check their terms and conditions just now. When does the return period run out?
I'm sorry but I am not familiar with buying goods in the US.
Because if we are not able to pin this down to one component, then it would be prudent to exchage the CPU, video card, and Mobo.

I am not being negative about finding a solution but I just want to ensure that you are left with a good fall-back position should we fail. Especially as you might not have enough money to buy replacement parts in the forseeable future.

[Tiretool]

southrk, you said you were using the most current detonator drivers so I'm assuming you're using the new Detonator 4 drivers version 21.81. If you aren't, go ahead and download them here. Looking back on this thread, I wish I had asked you this way earlier. When you click this link, scroll down to where it says TNT/TNT2 (don't worry, these aren't old drivers. They just haven't updated the section heading in quite some time.) and pick the top drivers if you've still got WinXP loaded as your Operating system or the second ones if you've reverted back to Win98. Try your games out then and get back with us.

If that doesn't solve your problem, and you feel like trying something fresh, you can install DirectX 8.1 v3 and see if it provides any change in appearance. Best of luck!

[Hpro]

One more thing before I go back to sleep - are this the only two games you have problem with? DID you go to the website of those games and looked for the Q&A? and eventually issues with the games on certain system and also for patches ?
If not then this would be the next step to do after you had run 3DMark2001 because this will take your computer to the edge of it's possibilities - I got with the same VGA you use on a brand new TUSL2-C Plll 1000 4025 points so try this and let me know - it's very hard to tell because I have no opportunity to sit behind your desktop.

And also in the pic you send me with the taskmanager I can't see the VOLUME control Icon - do you use SP live sound control instead?

I would try to turn of those apps running in the systray at once - I see you have Msn messenger running and also two three others - this I'm concerned about the sound which is still not solved -

If you don't mind go to START > RUN type MSINFO32 and click ok from the ACTION menu select SAFE FILE AS Information file and then send this to me - don't worry there aren't any critical data in there about you just if I can take a look at this file I may know what's going on and what's the trouble are...

I will post back as soon I had my gamer friend on the telephone..got to go to sleep have to be on the road 5 am..