Bottleneck: CPU or Graphics Card

[rtwjunkie]

I put together a gaming computer for my kids that saved me some money, and it has worked well for them playing Blacksite: Area 51, Far Cry, COD4, Need4Speed Carbon, Lost Planet, etc, but in the ever-itchy need to upgrade, I've got to ask: Based on the following stats is the computer about even, or what is the weak spot?

Core2Duo E4600 2.4Ghz (OC to 2.43); Conroe865pe mainboard; BFG 7800gs AGP (OC to 439Mhz core, 1.3Ghz memory); 2x1GB PC-3200 DDR; Soundblaster Audigy 2; Antec 550 watt PSU; all sitting in a Coolermaster Centurion5 case.

The cooling is phenomonal, with the CPU rarely if ever getting above 43 C, and with Rivatuner, the 7800gs rarely above 54 C. I know it's an old system, but I couldn't pass up the chance to upgrade their computer cheaply by only getting the motherboard on e-bay and the CPU for 129.00. It's amazing that the old and new go together so well. The motherboard can be set at 1066FSB (currently on 800), but I'm leary of taking it beyond where it is because the DDR is operating at 1:1 parity and I don't know how far beyond 200 it will go.

As an example, this system got 62.3fps on the HardwareOC Far Cry benchmark, and scored 85,514 on Aquamark 3 (13,545 GFX, 11,592 CPU). Gamewise, Lost Planet is extremely punishing, and Blacksite Area 51 isn't far behind, but COD4 runs great.

So, based on all that, is the hold up the graphics card or the cpu? Does it seem as if there is more potential in the cpu? I can possibly squeeze more out of the 7800gs.

[pam123]

You've got a bad case of the "in-betweens" there.
My advice is a new graphics card, if you "just have to", and otherwise let well enough alone while you plan the kid's next build.
You'll have to do a major upgrade so start reading up now.
Meanwhile don't stress out the kids, as you've noticed that build is holding up well and will continue to do so for at least another year.

[Prew]

It it hard to recommend upgrading an AGP video card- but it looks like the card is the weakest link in your system. You obviously like tinkering with computers to get the best performance; however, if this is for your kids to play games on, I would suggest you consider 'upgrading' to a PS3 (if they do not already have one) as your next major upgrade (unless the computer will be used for other tasks)

[rtwjunkie]

Thanks for the comment, Prew. Yeah, they use it for research, doing school papers and general internet too. I had a feeling that despite the system being a hybrid with old and new stuff on the same board that it was the video card holding it back. I came to this conclusion after some more research showed me that COD4 is more cpu-intensive. It runs great. Lost Planet crawls, and BS: Area 51 is slow. From what I've learned in the last couple days, those two are more dependant on the graphics card.

I'm going to do like Pam123 suggested, and save up for a year and build them a new PCIE-based system. Obviously I won't spend as much as I did on my rig. I guess they should be able to hold out for a year, since it's only a few games right now that really tax an AGP system, especially if it's running a C2D.

[Prew]

fyi: www.tomshardware.com has frequently updated articles concerning the best components for building a computer for under 500, under 1000, and under 2000 dollars. The articles are also supplemented with information about how well the builds will overclock.

For instance see: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...game,1810.html

[rtwjunkie]

Thanks Prew, that's a pretty good guide. And I can save money because I can re-use their case and PSU, and maybe even the cpu, which is quite a good little performer.

[David M]

rtw,
I have ran into the same dilemma. Whether to tear apart the old computer to use it for parts or to leave the old computer in tact and build a new computer from scratch effectively leaving you with two computers instead of one. If you have a number of people in your family, especially if they are kids or two adults that can't seem to agree on computer time, it might be better to build a new gaming computer from scratch.

Other than the case, its rare when old parts are the best thing or even usable for a new build...especially if the old computer is a few generations behind. Even so, some of the older cases are not large enough to accommodate the new longer graphics cards. A new power supply to power the latest gaming rig might cost you a couple hundred bucks and you can certainly get a new half decent case for under a hundred dollars. So effectively for the difference of $300, you get to keep your old computer in tact. Plus, its doubtful your old power supply would work with a new gaming rig. There are new power connectors (like the 6 pin connector that goes to the newer graphics cards) and higher power requirements for the new gaming machines than you had a few generations ago. 600 watts of true power and up is pretty commonplace for the faster gaming rigs now.

With the 45nm, 3.16 GHz E8500 CPU (overclockable to 4GHz on factory air cooling) now selling for $200 (see Pricegrabber.com), I would not put the old CPU in the new computer. I think you will find your current E4600 CPU being a distinct bottleneck with a new graphics card(s)...or you could keep the current one with that understanding and buy a really inexpensive CPU for the old computer like an E2160 for 60 bucks. The older computer will no longer be used for gaming anyway..right?

I think I would build a new machine from scratch and not sacrifice any of the old parts for the new machine....you end up with two computers this way.

These days you can get a pretty darn good gaming machine that can run Crysis at medium settings for between $1500 and $2000 if you build it yourself.

[rtwjunkie]

I appreciate it David M, that's good advice. In the meantime, I've taken to overclocking the kids' Frankenrig. I purchases 2x1Gb of Mushkin XP4000 Redline, that's capable of doing DDR500. Since the RAM and CPU are operating 1:1, that was perfect for overclocking. I've got it up to 218 in BIOS, so that's a 436 RAM FSB, and the CPU is doing 2.61Ghz. This CPU is amazing. Even overclocked, I still have not been able to get it beyond 41C, and that was after 4 hours of Prime95( 0errors, 0 warnings)!! My eventual goal is 230, which is well within spec for both RAM and CPU. All benchmark scores, including this old AGP card have gone way up. Lost Planet is playable now, Far Cry is up to 67.41 FPS, and Aquamark went from 85,514 to 05, 347.

So, I'll plan and save for the future, but this hybrid system still has some life in it. (and the kids are happier that games play smoother)