NHL 04 - 05 Season over....

[Fibre Optix]

Well the NHL has officialy canceled the 04-05 season today. I was just as suprised to see the sun come up this morning.

But it seems that NHL wants to go with replacement players... I mean come on, the big issue was the salary cap. The players finally gave in at the last minute with a 6 million dollar difference from what the NHL owners wanted. BULL.. the owners want scab labor.

So the question is (if your a fan of the NHL) will you watch the NHL next season WHEN they introduce replacement players?

(Trust me there will be a next season)

[mbossman2]

Originally Posted by Fibre Optix the owners want scab labor. [/I])

the owners want a fair shot at all teams to be profitable....if $6million (per team) is such a small amount, why not ask the fans to pay for it? Won't happen: hockey tickets are already expensive enough as it is.

Originally Posted by Fibre Optix (Trust me there will be a next season)

Pete Karmanos says that may not happen

In case this is protected:

Carolina Hurricanes owner Peter Karmanos says that if this National Hockey League season is canceled as expected Wednesday, the league might not return to the ice the next season either -- or even the season after that. "We have 30 owners that are lined up and saying we're going to lose a whole season, and maybe another one, and maybe another one after that," Karmanos said Monday.

- News and Observer

[rhdb52]

Dang, I was hoping for at least a short season this year. Would have been very exciting and competive (with less that 30 games to play).

I am a fan of hockey in general, so even though the NHL may not be the "real NHL", I still plan on watching it.

Is it certain there will be a season with just the replacement players next year? or is there still the possibility of getting the old NHL back?

[mbossman2]

if the players can swallow their pride and agree to a fiscally sound plan then yes...if not Bettman has said, in the past:

When I stood before you in September, I said NHL teams would not play again until our economic problems had been solved

I am not sure if Bettman feels that replacements solve the economic problems

[doctorgonzo]

From what I understand, the owners just want to bust the union. The owners say that they are all going bankrupt, but the player's union found that they were hiding revenues to make it look poorer than they really are. In this last round of negotiations, the players turned about and accepted a hard salary cap, but the owners still didn't negotiate. Once the players accepted the cap, it just boiled down to an argument over money, and they could have just split the difference (owners wanted $40 million cap, players $52 million with a luxury tax starting at $40 million...why not say $46 million for a year or two and then go back to the table?)

The fact that the owners wouldn't concede anything when the players made a major concession shows that the owners don't care about the season, just destroying the players union itself.

[mbossman2]

I know and understand that the players (workers) have a right to organize, but don't the owners also have the right to say "thanks but no thanks"?

[doctorgonzo]

Originally Posted by mbossman2 I know and understand that the players (workers) have a right to organize, but don't the owners also have the right to say "thanks but no thanks"?

Sure they do. I just think you have to look at the owners' motivations here. Would compromising a few million on the cap be a deathblow to the owners? Certainly not. So they must have reasons other than financial for refusing to compromise. I think the stories should just point out that the owners didn't say "No thanks" due to the financials of the players' offer, but due to something else, whatever that may be.

It is also important to note that the players' offer also included the 24% salary rollback they have always offered. So the players offered a 24% pay cut, a luxury tax at $40 million, and a hard cap at $52 million. Is that so far away from the owners' demand for a hard cap at $40 million that they had to say "No thanks?" I have a hard time seeing that.

I don't even care about hockey anyway.

[Statica]

Personally, I dont care about the owners making oodles of money more than they report, or about hockey players' making more money than the better pro leagues (for a league that doesnt make as much money to begin with). What I care about is having some amount of competitive balance to the teams, because as a fan, I dont want to watch a New York Yankee kind of scenario. I want to see players being able to be developed by a team, and try to win with the team, I want to be able to see some amount of parity in the league where any team has a fighting chance of making it to the post season; without either having to gut their team out with high priced acquisitions to make one run at it. Or having to dump their veterans to grab cash.

The only way, as a fan, I can see that happen is if there is a system that curbs free for all spending - Salary cap, without luxury tax preferably and with revenue sharing between owners.

[Panama Red]

Frankly, Scarlett, I don't give a .......

Bring on the Daytona 500! NASCAR rules!

[HAL9000]

I could care less about Hockey, so throw it all out the window!

[mbossman2]

Originally Posted by HAL9000 I could care less about Hockey, so throw it all out the window!

careful, the enforcers of all things canadian may come to visit and toss you out.

Originally Posted by Panama Red Frankly, Scarlett, I don't give a ....... Bring on the Daytona 500! NASCAR rules!

Sunday SundaySunday

it all starts again...

the 150's are tomorrow night

[Propain]

Originally Posted by Statica I dont want to watch a New York Yankee kind of scenario.

hehehe the Rangers have been doing that for years to no avail lol

[VERCETTI]

WHO CARES ABOUT HOCKEY

[Fibre Optix]

What I can't understand is that, the NHL wants a 42 Mill salary cap. BUT!!! there are only 9 teams which spend above and beyond 42 mill in salaries. How can a 42 mill Salary cap help? MMMM I don't buy it.... Betman wants scabs.

Just remember this next October.

NASCAR? If I wanted to watch cars make left hand turns for 3 hours, I'd go to the closest busy intersection. LOL

[Fibre Optix]

Originally Posted by VERCETTI WHO CARES ABOUT HOCKEY

I DO!

Please don't add your 2 cents if you have no money in your pocket.

[mc2phat]

I'll watch. Maybe the Blues will get some decent scabs and not choke in the playoffs. I basically root for "laundry." If he's wearing a Blues jersey, I want him to win. Biggest mistake they ever made was getting rid of Cujo.

[Statica]

Originally Posted by Fibre Optix NASCAR? If I wanted to watch cars make left hand turns for 3 hours, I'd go to the closest busy intersection. LOL

Yeah I can't stand Nascar. More than caring about hockey, I am just a sports nut. A few turns and loops wouldn't hurt - I love F1.

Originally Posted by Fibre Optix What I can't understand is that, the NHL wants a 42 Mill salary cap. BUT!!! there are only 9 teams which spend above and beyond 42 mill in salaries. How can a 42 mill Salary cap help? MMMM I don't buy it.... Betman wants scabs.

The NHL did not want a 42 m. salary cap, its original proposal was sthing in the range of 32-42 million. Which would be more in tune with what it originally wanted. It does appear that Bettman wants a new set of ground rules. Look at the NBC deal, no money upfront for TV rights? That's just wonderful.

Originally Posted by propain hehehe the Rangers have been doing that for years to no avail lol

The NY Rangers are the equivalent of Texas Rangers in my analogy I think Detroit or Colorado would be more befitting in this case
Yeah but, that isnt my point, they just keep taking players out of otherwise viable franchises. Don't get me wrong, I am in Maple Leaf land one of the big spenders (they invest heavily in washed out has-beens), but I do not like the prospect of franchises developing players only to be put in a case where they cant really sign them.
In order to give teams a fighting chance they need to have teams that can spend comparatively and not fill their teams up with goons, who clutch and grab, as an alternative to countering the skills of a pricier team.

[VERCETTI]

Jing jing, plenty of bling bling in my pocket. I dont like nascar, dont like hockey...hell I dont like any sports except female mud wrestling

[shazam]

Nascar--Nascar I think there the only sport with out a union. But then again is Nascar a sport. The players will be back next year This is not the first time this has happend.

[Tin]

heres a piece of trivia for you guys.....when the Boston Red Sox won the World Series in 1919, there was no Stanley Cup Final....same thing applies today . damn you Boston!

Originally Posted by mc2phat Biggest mistake they ever made was getting rid of Cujo.

no it wasnt, cuz we (Detroit) have him now .

im also not a fan of NASCAR, rally racing is much more exciting....jumps and death defying turns....what more could you want in a good race?

[Strider]

I could careless if the NHL ever comes back, I've have really never been a real big hockey fan, I'm a Detroit Fan so I was happy when the Red Wings did good but that was all. As far as I'm concerned Professional Players (NHL, NFL, MLB, NBA) all make too much money as it is, but if the owners are stupid enough to pay for them to play, so be it. I can see the Players side to an extent, if the some owners are stupid enough to pay them want they want, why should there be a salary cap? We're not talking about your average Ma & Pa owner, but multi-millionares (even billionares) owners, take Peter Karmanos one of the richer owners who has a grudge against Mike Ilitch who decided to buy a NHL team to get back at him, all because Ilitch booted his Junior Hockey Team out of Joe Louis Arena. Talk about having $$$$ to throw around and it dosen't hurt that his also owns Compuware (Had to throw in something related to computers ), if he's willing to spend money on players then why all the sudden the "Owners" are crying bankrupcy or near bankrupcy? Just my .02 cents.

[glc]

I haven't cared one bit about hockey for many years - since the hockey rink turned into a boxing ring. I *HATE* fighting in ANY sport (including boxing!). If you want to fight, go join the Army or the Marines and go fight the terrorists.

[Tin]

Originally Posted by glc I haven't cared one bit about hockey for many years - since the hockey rink turned into a boxing ring. I *HATE* fighting in ANY sport (including boxing!). If you want to fight, go join the Army or the Marines and go fight the terrorists.

thats whats always appalled me about hockey....that fights are an acceptable part of the game. i like hockey simply because i enjoy watching those great plays that are put on. wonder who the next Stanley Cup contender will be with scabs on the lineup?

[HAL9000]

What is truly disturbing isn't the fact that fighting is an acceptable part of hockey... rather that the fans demand it. They tried several years ago to put a ban on fighting, but fans refused to buy tickets then.

[nubbler]

I don't really care for watching hockey either, I love playing it though. (Without the fights)


...and then there is Don Cherry. (That is to me, the most exciting part of the game)

----

Originally Posted by HAL9000 What is truly disturbing isn't the fact that fighting is an acceptable part of hockey... rather that the fans demand it. They tried several years ago to put a ban on fighting, but fans refused to buy tickets then.

Ever heard te saying?
"I went to a fighting match and a hockey game broke out"

[Fibre Optix]

Originally Posted by HAL9000 What is truly disturbing isn't the fact that fighting is an acceptable part of hockey... rather that the fans demand it. They tried several years ago to put a ban on fighting, but fans refused to buy tickets then.

Completley agree with the fighting issue, I would not miss it if it disappeared. But fighting has decreased drasticaly over the past 10 years. However I have to admit that sometimes I enjoy watching guys like Mathew Barnaby get his licks. (On second thought they should ban guys like him instead)

Americans (majority, not all) are the ones who seem to love the fighting.

Example... Toronto vs Detroit.. Next day in the Toronto paper 1st page of sports section, a shot of the winning goal or a player of the winning team with his hands up. In the Detroit paper underneath girls highschool basketball a picture of the fight.

That's the difference.

The American media (and somethimes Canadian) is the first in line to condemn violence in hockey (or any sport) but the only time they report hockey is when they're is a fight or a guy like Todd Bertuzzi does something stupid.

Then on top of that you have owners in Nashville and Atlanta promising hockey fans there (hockey fans in Nashvill, LOL) at least one fight per game.