Any late 80's car Owners?

[rspassey]

I've been browsing the market for a car, as I soon will be able to pass my graduated license test (and be able to drive *more*). Currently, while my parents said they would help me out, I'm interested in buying a car and insurance myself (I'll feel a little more pride this way, and will certainly take much more care of my car - if my parents help out, I'll feel like I'm in debt to them).

At the moment, I'm interested in spending no more than 5K (4K would be preferable). So, almost immediately, I've decided that I'll need to get a much older/used vehicle to fit into my price range (I don't really have to worry about it running forever - just a year and change, and then I'll be off the university and will get a new car / bike depending on where I go).

I've been looking a quite a few late 80's Towncars. Most seem to be in pretty decent overall shape, but I am not a car enthusiast and have no idea what signs to look for (signs of a dying engine, etc.).

So, I was wondering of anyone here owns a late 80's towncar (or equivilant) and would be able to comment on their performance to this date. Am I kiding myself in thinking that, with 120-150k miles, they will still run consistenly? Would it be more advisable to save my money and not get a car (invest into a money market / high interest CD)? To be honest, I don't need a car... however, my friends are maniacs and I really don't feel safe driving with them. I am a much more mature person and drive the speed limit, follow the rules, and actually follow the rules regarding the number of passengers. I value my life and would willing spend money on a car so that I don't have to drive with them.

Since my school is only 3 miles away (and that's all I really will drive to - maybe a couple trips to nashville to see a friend of mine - 120 miles), is there any chance that after owning the car, and not putting that many miles on it, (and keeping good care of it), I will be able to sell it again (and not lose a fortune)?

What questions should I ask the dealer regarding the history of the car?


TIA,
Ryan

[flanzig1]

You should be able to find cars from the early to mid 90's in your price range.
One thing to ask is whether the car is a local trade-in verses a car from an auto auction place.
If you find something that you like, you can take the VIN number and use CarFax to find out were the car is from/has the car been written off by an insurance company/real milage/etc.

[rspassey]

Would it be asking too much for the dealer to supply the CarFax - I think that would show willingness to sell and trust in their "products".

[glc]

I do NOT recommend buying old luxury cars in that price range. They are a maintenance headache, usually full of electric/electronic glitches that can cost a small fortune to trace down and repair.

Go for a more mainstream vehicle without a ton of options and toys, your experience with maintenance will be a lot better. You don't need a 4 wheeled living room or a gas hog.

For less than 5 grand, you can get something like a 2000 (yes, 2000!) Ford Taurus if your wishes are for a larger sized sedan. Unless it's been seriously abused, one of those should be quite reliable and economical to operate and maintain. The V6 engine in one of those is usually good for 150k+ miles and the transmission is usually good for about 120k.

[TallTravel]

Originally Posted by rspassey Would it be asking too much for the dealer to supply the CarFax - I think that would show willingness to sell and trust in their "products".

I think it is wise for you to keep asking questions, but not purchase yet, Ryan. I absolutely do not recommend your purchasinig a car of that sort and age at this point. I understand you want a big car, but my personal opinion is you are setting yourself up for lots and lots of repair bills to keep the thing moving.

My own personal experience with the CARFAX reports is that they are a complete joke, they miss countless critical events because of WHERE THEY GET THEIR DATA, and they report meaningless information because of WHERE THEY GET THEIR DATA.

I learned the most about Carfax when I did a couple of reports on cars I had purchased new. The information Carfax sold me was so inaccurate it was scary. I spoke with insurance adjustors and body shop people and heard them consistently laugh out loud when I mentioned a Carfax report.

Carfax is far, far, better at marketing than they are gathering accurate information.

All of this is just my opinion.

[HAL9000]

There should be plenty of choices for $5K... as G suggested, things that aren't land yachts. Heck, my old beater wagon which was a 1987, I paid $650, and that was over 5 years ago. Find yourself something in the very late 90's, early 2000's that's not going to break you at the pump.

[thefultonhow]

If you want a land yacht, a two-minute Autotrader search for cars between $3000 and $4000 turned up this:

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=209681061

1995 Cadillac DeVille, 82,000 miles, "loaded." $3,900.

[TallTravel]

Originally Posted by HAL9000 There should be plenty of choices for $5K... as G suggested, things that aren't land yachts. Heck, my old beater wagon which was a 1987, I paid $650, and that was over 5 years ago. Find yourself something in the very late 90's, early 2000's that's not going to break you at the pump.

I am expecting the price of gas to jump again as soon as the elections are done, so if he does end up with a land yacht, maybe waiting until after the election would offer more choices for a car like that. That is, of course, if my theory is true. If it is not, then...never mind!

[rspassey]

Thanks for the suggestions guys. I agree about the gas deal - It'd be different if I had the cash to throw around; but at the moment I do not. I'll definately look at something a lot less luxurious and around the 2000 models. I'll have to ask my grandparents about their taurus - I think it's a 2001, and maybe they'd be interested in selling it to me.

I'm going to keep my eyes open, and I'm definately a few months away, at the least, from comitting to anything. If driving with my friends didn't scare the crap out of me, I wouldn't even buy a car and just borrow my parents when possible. I'll see come december / january time period how much money I have saved.

[TallTravel]

Originally Posted by rspassey Thanks for the suggestions guys. I agree about the gas deal - It'd be different if I had the cash to throw around; but at the moment I do not. I'll definately look at something a lot less luxurious and around the 2000 models. I'll have to ask my grandparents about their taurus - I think it's a 2001, and maybe they'd be interested in selling it to me. I'm going to keep my eyes open, and I'm definately a few months away, at the least, from comitting to anything. If driving with my friends didn't scare the crap out of me, I wouldn't even buy a car and just borrow my parents when possible. I'll see come december / january time period how much money I have saved.

A lot of people won't consider it, but would purchasing a motorcycle work for you for the next few months? Your region of the country is relatively warm, so the winter weather would likely not cause a huge problem for you.

Just a thought.

[glc]

If he is scared to ride with his friends and he was looking at land yachts, I don't think he's a candidate for a motorcycle at this time. He needs the security of some sheet metal around him.

[rspassey]

Originally Posted by glc If he is scared to ride with his friends and he was looking at land yachts, I don't think he's a candidate for a motorcycle at this time. He needs the security of some sheet metal around him.

Exactly why I was leaning toward large cars. To me, they just seem safer (I don't know if they are or not). I drove a tiny puegeot 307 in BA... and this thing just felt too small / light - while driving I always felt like it was on the verge of just coupling in when I went over a speed bump.

I actually came across a 94 LeSabre for 2K today at the used lot. If it's still there next weekend, which I really hope it is, I'm going to take it for a spin and probably see if I can talk them down a tad into 1800 (so that after the 189$ fees are through I hit low 2000s with tax).

It's not until 07, when I hit 17, that I can drive with less restictions, but I figure that if I get the car now and still have a little money left over, I can pratice driving in it with my parents, use it on the next driving test, and have the 4 or so months to continue saving money. I'll have to look into insurance costs aswell.

[Brad the best]

my list of vehicles
89 jeep cherokee two door 2500$ 180 000 miles
88 nissan maxima . fully loaded .horrible car it was a girft it has a million problems usually , right now its working , alot of stuff is home made , and engine mount costs 300$ so i made one , imports are bad . 240 000 km
99 mazda protege 850$ . it needed the head plained and the valves done , i know a guy at a machine shop who did it for a case of beer . it works wonderfully , 300 000 km

you should be able to get something pretty nice for that kind of money . like early 90s a 96 is ten years old . almost 11 , but like i said the protege needs engine mounts aswell , this is going to cost around 500 $ . for two , in my sisters 92 daytona about 60 $ a peice . i even think they are cheeper for our 04 1 ton dodge , diesel .

80's vehicles can be bad , they were still messing with fuel injection systems , computer systems werent so great , some had problems . like that nissan , and some didn't .

[thefultonhow]

How many miles on the LeSabre? I'm suspicious of most high-mile domestics. Some of them are bulletproof but others can be a nightmare.

No matter what, if you get an older car, it's going to start nickel and diming you. Even if it has low miles, things deteriorate:

-- Probably 90% of the things that have gone wrong on my Infiniti went wrong after 120k miles. Things have been wearing out gradually -- clutch, engine seals, AC, etc. I was amazed at how much needed to be replaced as I was swapping out the engine; besides the engine, I replaced the radiator, right-front axle, front pads and rotors, clutch, and probably some other stuff that I'm forgetting. I think the starter is on the way out now too. What was going to be a $500 job ended up costing me $1200+ -- and that was for parts alone.
-- My Subaru Legacy, on the other hand, only has 65k-70k, but it's 16 years old and since January has had a full tuneup, purge control solenoid replaced, right-front axle replaced, and speed sensor replaced. As of now it needs the left front axle, battery, and a new clutch.
-- My dad's 2001 Forester just hit 120k miles and we recently had to put a fair amount of money into it.

If you're on a budget, you're going to have to factor upkeep into that budget. Even if a cheap car has been maintained extremely well and garage-kept (e.g. my Infiniti), there are going to be things wrong with it.

[David M]

Ryan,
Personally, I would not trust any older small or large domestic cars. It's not necessarily car mass that will protect you in a collision although that helps. Look at the crash test ratings in Edmunds. Older Japanese cars, for your budget, are the best bang for the bucks. You can find pleanty of 100K mile cars that have pleanty of life left in them with high crash test ratings. You don't need a new car for college...who cares? If you are trying to impress the women with a new car in college...forget it..they don't care either. Save the serious relationships for after college. Keep the same car and instead spend the same money on your education and not a new car.

[rspassey]

Originally Posted by David M Ryan, Personally, I would not trust any older small or large domestic cars. It's not necessarily car mass that will protect you in a collision although that helps. Look at the crash test ratings in Edmunds. Older Japanese cars, for your budget, are the best bang for the bucks. You can find pleanty of 100K mile cars that have pleanty of life left in them with high crash test ratings. You don't need a new car for college...who cares? If you are trying to impress the women with a new car in college...forget it..they don't care either. Save the serious relationships for after college. Keep the same car and instead spend the same money on your education and not a new car.

Well, it's not entirely a new car when I go to college (and I'm not out to impress anyone). The college program I want to do may and probably will require lots of relocation (it's a Co-Op deal), so my parents are going to give me my dad's barely used focus when I go to college - in a sense it will be almost new.

I'll take a look around. If I put off buying until the end of next summer, I'll have a lot more money as I plan to work all summer... I also, however, will have to depend on my mom to drive me to and from work, etc.

This week, my dad is going to look into insurance costs - that will give me a little better gauge as to how much I can spend... I'm expecting my insurance to run in the range of 1500, but I'll probably be shocked.

The sabre looks pretty junk with around 130k miles. I'm scratching it off my list.

[als814]

Originally Posted by glc For less than 5 grand, you can get something like a 2000 (yes, 2000!) Ford Taurus if your wishes are for a larger sized sedan. Unless it's been seriously abused, one of those should be quite reliable and economical to operate and maintain. The V6 engine in one of those is usually good for 150k+ miles and the transmission is usually good for about 120k.

I have a 98 taurus, and while I would like a sports car, it works perfectly for my needs. I can vouch for it's reliability, and I'd bet the engine is going to last until closer to 200,000 since it still sounds fine, but the transmission was only good for a little less than 100k. I'm at 120k and the only thing that's ever been replaced other than the transmission was a fuel pump.

[Hi Ho]

I'm with DavidM in recomending an older Japanese car. They really do last forever and are safe. My car, a 90 Civic, has 347,000 miles on it and climbing fast. It still hasn't given me any problems and it's still on the original clutch. I commute 64 miles a day. I haven't even maintained it "properly". I change the oil maybe every 10-15,000 miles, the transmission oil is the same oil that was added in the factory in 1989. If you want a trouble free car without spending a fortune you can't go wrong with a Honda.

[glc]

The problem with used Japanese cars is they hold their resale value - you can't get a good one for under 5 grand with less than 100K on it and they are gonna be older than domestics.

[rspassey]

Thanks again for the suggestions guys. I'll keep it all in mind. I'm convincing myself to hold off until the new year before purchasing, but I'm still going to look everyweekend... if I find a great deal, then I will take it to a mechanic and have one of my more car enthusiast friends look it over.

[rspassey]

Aight... I'm kinda going against the advice in this thread, but this weekend (if the car hasn't sold yet), I'm going to arrange a visit with the owner of a 92 V6 Continental - the newspaper price is 1.5K... and if I can talk him down to either exclude taxes or drop the price a little bit, and the car is in decent shape, I will probably just buy it. My dad has already made up his mind that he will give me his focus when I go to university because he wants to buy a new car in the next year or so anyways... so if I get the continental, it will only have to last me around a year and a half.

I hope everything goes well, because, depending on the insurance, I should be able to get it without completely depleting my savings. Do you guys know what the policy is about insurance if I'm not going to drive it immediately? Do I still need to buy it if the cars just going to sit in the garage for a month or more?

[thefultonhow]

At least in Maryland, any car that is registered has to be insured. You can get around this by not registering it, though. My Infiniti is currently not registered or insured, and it's perfectly legal that way because I'm not driving it at this point.

Keep in mind that it will cost more to re-register the car if you turn in the registration, and it will have to be re-inspected. If the car will pass inspection, though, it shouldn't be a problem and it will probably cost less overall if you don't have to pay insurance in the meantime.

[rspassey]

Originally Posted by thefultonhow At least in Maryland, any car that is registered has to be insured. You can get around this by not registering it, though. My Infiniti is currently not registered or insured, and it's perfectly legal that way because I'm not driving it at this point. Keep in mind that it will cost more to re-register the car if you turn in the registration, and it will have to be re-inspected. If the car will pass inspection, though, it shouldn't be a problem and it will probably cost less overall if you don't have to pay insurance in the meantime.

I'll look into it... I probably wont drive it (assuming I get a car soon) for a while because my current stage of my license doesn't allow me to drive past 10 PM or something like that - when I'm out with friends (who either dont care about driving restrctions or have a different level of license), we are usually out past 10. I can, however, just leave it in the garage and bring it out to register and get insurance when I want to start driving it.

[glc]

If that Continental has the 3.8 liter V6, it had issues. Those engines ate head gaskets for lunch. It's also going to have all the issues that other old luxury cars have with electrics, etc.

[rspassey]

Alright, I'm going to gather as much information on the car as I can - via phone... because its not in the best area of the city - I'll then compare its specs to some google queries to see what comes up.

[HAL9000]

Ford + electrical issues = disaster

Statica, insert picture below

http://www.midnight-x.com/1128/mustang.jpg

[David M]

Ryan,
First get the title of your car in your parents name (not yours) and get yourself on their policy. This will save you insurance money.

The car does not have to be insured if your parents sign a Certificate of Non-Operation issued by the DMV. Given the car is worth only $1,500 and you will not be driving it right away, there is no sense in insuring the car until you start driving it. Just be sure to park it off the street. This will save you money as well.

[rspassey]

It was in a lot worse condition than I thought it was going to be, so I didn't even bother considering taking for a test drive, let alone purchasing it...

back to the drawing board, I guess.

[HAL9000]

You have to remember too, a lot of these old luxury car owners think their cars are worth their weight in gold... I've seen many over priced cars, but because they were a Linc, Caddy, etc, they wanted big $$

[glc]

$1500 isn't exactly big bucks. A friend of a friend just got a 92 Caddy for $800 - guess what? He's put $2000 in repairs into it and it's still in nasty shape.