Ubuntu needs an improvement or two.

[Computer Hobbyist]

A week ago I loaded Ubuntu on my linux machine. In my week's experience, admittedly not long, it has become apparent that ubuntu needs some refinement before it can take on Windows in the home market. Specifically it needs an easy seamless method for allowing a windows machine to print from a local printer. Yes I know all about cups, but the average windows user doesn't. When you have to go to the command line to allow other computers on your home network to access your printer, the distro is not yet ready for prime time. Second, samba also requires command line intervention. Not a problem for a Linux user, but hardly the thing to endear the distro to former Windows users. Finally ubuntu is not really good at dealing with network passwords. When I want to access a windows computer on my home network, I want to be sure I don't have password problems. Again something I can deal with on a command line basis, but something the average windows user will never understand. I suspect within the next few days I am going to move debian or some other full bodied distribution with better tools.

As a stand alone unit ubuntu is unsurpassed, but it needs to learn how to play nice and to play nice easily with windows machines on a home network

[Ind-PC_student]

As said on the ubunto.org web site you can provide your feedback and if you are willing your cooperation in the project will be very valued.

Put this to the devs team and they might find a solution fo your problem.

good luck.

[Computer Hobbyist]

Originally Posted by Ind-PC_student As said on the ubunto.org web site you can provide your feedback and if you are willing your cooperation in the project will be very valued. Put this to the devs team and they might find a solution fo your problem. good luck.

I registered and left a post. I just don't understand why I am not able to log on to my windows computers. I know the passwords. I set them up myself.

[faulkner132]

Sorry to hear that HC.

Personally, I use Ubuntu and my wife uses a Mac. When I get the time I am going to set up Samba so we can share our music.

I think you are right on in that it is ready to be a standalone workstation or even a webserver (rediculously easy to get LAMP up and running), but not a network workstation. I think they are getting there though. I think I am going to permanently stick with Ubuntu, as I only see leaps and bounds of improvements in the future.

[glc]

By its very nature (open source) Linux is a perpetual work in progress.

[faulkner132]

Originally Posted by glc By its very nature (open source) Linux is a perpetual work in progress.

I would say this is true for any OS.

The problems with Linux right now are:
1. There are too many distributions and each seems to have the NIH (Not Invented Here) mentality to some extent leading to the same basic program being written for each distro.
2. Does not have a viable business model or finacial backing. Yes there are companies which sell support services (RedHat and Novell/Suse), but Windows (and to a lesser extent Apple) have many more resources available to put into R&D.

I think Ubuntu is on the right track by making CD's available to be shipped to you at no charge and with the setup and hardware detection being very good. It still goes back to what CH said, it doesn't act like Windows (which is not a knock on it... Linux is not Windows), but this is the paradigm 99% of the computer users are comfortable with.

Once Ubuntu has a viable financial model which, lets face it, it really does have to in order to survive in the long run, I can see it taking marketshare from Microsoft.

[Computer Hobbyist]

As I said ubuntu does a good job standing alone. The problem I find is working with Windows, but I am not sure I am not having firewall problems created by one of the Windows2000 updates I have installed.

One of my problems is that Linux has gotten out of hand when it comes to documentation. Most applications are totally devoid of documentation. I realize that it is much harder to write help files than it is to write the application and it is not nearly as much fun, but documentation is a big issue. Especially when it comes to dealing with obscurely named applications dealing with not well understood background processes and the effects of equally undocumented "security" updates.

[faulkner132]

Originally Posted by Computer Hobbyist One of my problems is that Linux has gotten out of hand when it comes to documentation. Most applications are totally devoid of documentation. I realize that it is much harder to write help files than it is to write the application and it is not nearly as much fun, but documentation is a big issue. Especially when it comes to dealing with obscurely named applications dealing with not well understood background processes and the effects of equally undocumented "security" updates.

I agree with you 100%.

Seems Wiki's and Message Boards are the new form of "documentation" for open source projects. Let the community create living documentation. Nonetheless There still needs to be a basic level supplied by the development team.

As for security updates, on my home computer, I blindly install the updates without thinking twice on Ubuntu. I trust their development/QA team moreso than Microsoft's... have had too many cases where their automatic updates confict with critical applications (in one case, IIS even).

[Computer Hobbyist]

I am slowly working my way out of my problem and in a day or two I should be able to see my shares on my windows machines from my linux machine and visa versa.

[Winnipesaukee]

Also, the media support is terrible

No MP3 support for example, the avg WIndows user will have no clue what Gstreamer is

[faulkner132]

Originally Posted by Winnipesaukee No MP3 support for example, the avg WIndows user will have no clue what Gstreamer is

It just cannot be included in the distro because the patent holders want 75 cents per machine. No truely free distro can afford to pay this, so they let the users install it themselves.

[Computer Hobbyist]

Originally Posted by faulkner132 It just cannot be included in the distro because the patent holders want 75 cents per machine. No truely free distro can afford to pay this, so they let the users install it themselves.

This is where we get to the problem with "free" software. Some people want to make a living writing shrinkwrapped.

It is also the strength of the movement.

The second part is absolutely true and it is a problem Ubuntu can do something about. The average Windows user will have no idea what Gstreamer is, and the distros, lacking any reasonable documentation, don't go out of their way to tell. They assume the average user is well schooled in Linux applications.

[ygidanoc]

I cannot wait for ubuntu to become usable. Hopefully in 2-3 years you wont need the command line anymore.

[Computer Hobbyist]

I wrote the beginnings of an explanation of the problems I have been encountering with Ubuntu (problems related to security issues surrounding Samba and SMB that have arisen in the last months,) but it was lost in submission. Short version, a couple of years ago Samba enjoyed some easy to use but extremely powerful graphical front ends. Those front ends were the source of security concerns. Instead of correcting the front ends, they were simply chucked and we returned to the command line (or to clunky GUIs you see today.) Experts like Statica don't care. They love the command line. Home users were hurt. Editing samba conf and password files at the command line or in VI can be intimidating for us. Microsoft had the same problems with SMB, but at great expense they were able to come up with some GUI work arounds. Actually home networking in the current verisons of Windows XP isn't as easy and intuitive as possible, but it is much easier than in Linux.

Where I really meandered in my previous post was my take on the GPL in the home market. That deserves a longer post, but bottom line the GPL, as currently written, works just fine for the enterprise solution boys at Redhat, IBM and Sun (they sell solutions not code), but it is nearly impossible for shrink wrapped applications to succeed in the Linux market. Better open source licenses are available. See the Berkley license or the Apache license. Too bad one of them wasn't adopted. Linux would have taken over the world by now.

[ygidanoc]

Xandros works out of the box with my windows shares etc. It is really nicely done but the only problem is it barely has any applications for it, so you will have to compile from source yourself.

[apappasmurf]

Hi! HC
I agree with your sentiments 100%.
As A Silver Surfer I have found Trying to get Linux to run the way I want very very frustrating. After many trials and tribulations I finally get Kubuntu to install on my SATA hard drive. The next thing. Is my Nebula Electronics DigiTV tuner detected? No I can't find a mention of Nebula Electronics or DigiTV. Here we go yet again search the webs for a driver for the tuner. I find out that the card has indeed been detected, great, I am also advised that I had to install either kdetv or tvtime but they are for analogue. Not to worry Kaffeine is sitting on my desk top, it should be simple to run that?? NBC Yet more hours of trawling the web sites and I still can not get it to run.
Yes Statcia the best way to learn about computing is to use the command line. But you had to start somewhere. Possibly at school or at least fairly early in life. I too want to learn but I need a working computer to learn as I think hands on is the best way of learning. Yes I need my hand holding in the early stages. I found It very very frustrating when an installation trouble shooting guide and a few pointers how to set up packages like kaffeine.
Yes I know there are legal issues as to why it can not run out of the box. Us newbies need to know what packages we need, where to find them and how they fit together.
I am sorry for going on a bit, but I think a guy migrating from windows, where software is easy to install would get frustrated and go back to windows. On the other hand if they had a set of instructions or a guide as to how set up Amarok. They may well go on to learn the CLI.
Again I am sorry for moaning.
TonyS