Iraqi Surrender

[Paul Victorey]

OK, this was too good to not post:

http://www.suntimes.com/output/iraq/...rrender10.html

I wonder if this is the first time that people have surrendered before they were even at war?

On a more somber note, I certainly hope these soldiers don't suffer because of their 'surrender'. I bet Saddam would not look kindly on deserters.

[M. A. Dockter]

If you were a conscript in the army of a leader you despised; probably from one of the two political minorities in the nation.

If you were horribly kept; given few supplies and even less moral support.

If you were staring into the face of the best trained and best supplied soldiers in the world, would you not save your life in surrender, knowing you would be well-kept and looked out for.

I don’t think it’s funny; I would.

[Force Flow]

That's...astounding...

It goes to show how some of the people in Iraq feel about the situation. Not everyone is gung-ho.

I completely agree with you M. A. Dockter

[morriswindgate]

Iraq and for that matter, most all of the Arab countries are ran by a single family or tribe, much like it would be if the Gambino Mafia family was running New York. As such there is very little loyalty to the regimes from the non-family members.
Also Sadaam has also made a fatal mistake during his tenture, namely treating the general population as enemies instead of indoctronating them.
Over the last few days, I have read several articles where up to 30,000 Regular and Republican Guard troops have signalled an intention to surrender at the start of hostilities.

[Force Flow]

I wonder if that means Sadaam will be left with almost no army...

[juppy]

I've read several stories on this topic lately and one thing always confuses the heck out of me. If this is how Saddam's troops react to the possibility of war, why does he keep spouting all this stuff about "being met at the border with wave after wave" of his military? Yeah, maybe we will be met with "wave after wave" of them, but apparently he left out the part about the soldiers being the "surrender party" instead of the fighting ones.

[Jomama]

That is a riot!. they told them to go home (and come back in 48 hours, I guess). Jeez, why not take the guys in.Give 'em a sandwich and tell them to get the hell out of Iraq and Kuwait.

[i3OSS]

Saddam says that if the US military touches Iraq, he will start WW III....now thats something i really dont want happening...i really wanted to grow up and have a family and most of all make as many builds i could before i die...but not like this...not like this....

[Paul Victorey]

Well, for him to start WW3, that would require that somebody else fight at his side. His list of allies is thin; even the people who hate the US (Al Quaida, Iran) also hate him just as badly. Most of the rest of the Arab world doesn't like him much -- there was even an Arab League proposal to order Saddam to step down. It didn't pass, but the fact that it had any support at all tells you something about him.

Even insofar as there is a lot of antiamerican sentiment worldwide, I doubt any nation wants to board a sinking ship by allying with Iraq.

I wouldn't say we won't see a WW3, but if/when it comes, my bets are that it originates with N. Korea, China, or Pakistan.

[Byte 2.0]

Maybe the French will join him, wait they won't do that either.

[Paul Victorey]

Nah, the French/Germans/Chinese don't really like Saddam, they are just miffed over the constant stream of snubs they've endured from Bush. So they do the only thing they CAN do, they refuse to support him.

I mean, in their defense, Bush DID go in front of the whole world, months ago, and said we'd go after Saddam with or without the UN's approval. It's a horrible slight to the nations on the security council, it basically says "Your opinions don't matter to us".

Of course they everyone knew we'd do it alone, but there's no good reason to SAY it to the whole world.

[avx]

I cant help but feel bad for those guys. However...I WILL laugh at them, LoL, they must have been plotting this or something...

"Hey Hofoijwfi, when the guns go off, we just walk over to the other side and just save our own arses...

Well that sounds good Lounohdfh, but wont Saddam be mad?

Screw that crazy old coot...hes going down faster than Micheal Jacksons career....

Youh...your right..."
Im bettin it went something like that

Imagine the conversation on the way back to the other side LOL

[TimPoet]

Originally posted by byte Maybe the French will join him, wait they won't do that either.

LMAO!!

[Hot Rod]

The thing I'm worried about is N. Korea taking the opportunity of us attacking Iraq to start something. Not necessarily that they will be allied with Iraq. Just taking advantage of the situation. And then if that happens, will Pakistan or India take advantage of that situation to start something between themselves.

I don't think WWIII would be like World War II where you have clear cut sides. I see WWIII as separate wars feeding upon themselves and just spiraling the world out of control.

What we can hope is that the Iraqi thing is taken care of swiftly to avoid this scenario.

[pillainp]

As an Indian, I sincerely believe that my nation will not "start something" with Pakistan, but it is my strong conviction that we should not stand by and allow them to "start something" with us. We do not want war, but we will if we are forced to.

[Strider]

I'll add my .02 cents and after that I'll make no replies to this subject matter, afterall it's a computer forum.

I hope that President Bush knows what he is doing, if he doesn't then the U.S. and possibly the rest of the world is in BIG trouble. Instead of making the world safer, I feel he has made it worse by taking this course of action. I'm not saying Saddam shouldn't be taking care of, but why does it always seem the United States have to be the Bad Cop. Hopefully this will be a short war, minimum casaulities (on both sides) and that once it is done we (United States) can do things to mend fences with the world, especially with people of the Muslim faith.

[suitcase]

When North Korea sees what is happening in Iraq, they will do some posturing and mouthing off, but believe me, they don't want any part of what Iraq is getting. They know that to fire one of their Nukes would be suicide. Remember we only have about a third of our forces in the middle east. If we had to, we could deal with North Korea with out batting an eye. And this time it won't be like last time. We have President who won't set lines that we can't cross. If the government had left Mac Arthur alone there wouldn't be a North Korea now, just Korea and we would be buying quality products from them like we do Japan. How fast do you think the North Korean army would surrender? How fast would you if you were starving?

[Paul Victorey]

The danger with North Korea would be the same as during the Korean war -- alone, they are weak, but if the Chinese back them, they have the support of a world superpower.

MacArthur could have gotten into a lot of trouble with nukes in Korea, as well -- China had nuclear capabilities from the USSR, and it's possible that nuking N. Korea could have ended in total thermonuclear war between China, the USA, and the USSR.

[icallmedan]

I heard about that too, and it is pretty funny, and just to let you know, that link no longer works.

[raftero]

but why does it always seem the United States have to be the Bad Cop.
Because we can and nobody else seems willing.i found out a long time ago if you want to get a good whipping let the other guy get the first lick.just my thoughts.i should not have said no one,there are lots of other nations helping,one way or the other.

[redbaron_snoopy]

I think the road ahead for American soldiers is going to be treacherous. The real fight has not started yet as Iraqi troops are dug-in to defend Bagdag. They have the advantage of defense.
FIBUA is going to extract a high casualty rate.

The incidents in the last 24hrs suggest resistance is just starting.
And the muslim-American seargent who threw 3 grenades at his own team is going to cause a serious morale problem and jitter.

The ground fightings I see on TV are all in daytime. US should use its technology advantage to conduct night ground operations. Just my 2 cents worth.