Anyone try Boot Camp yet?

[Two|Bit]

What do you think? Is it going to make Apple millions? How was the whole process, simple? it would seem that apple would make it very easy to do. How is it on the whole, and would you recommend getting a mac for it?

[Alaron]

There is a thread about this in General Discussion. Plenty of information and ideas. http://forum.pcmech.com/showthread.php?t=156314

[hobey19]

Originally Posted by Two|Bit What do you think? Is it going to make Apple millions? How was the whole process, simple? it would seem that apple would make it very easy to do. How is it on the whole, and would you recommend getting a mac for it?

i ordered a mini the other day, and plan on using bootcamp. i will be posting a full review thread assuming someone hasn't done one by then

craig

[pam123]

I'm expecting it to turn up but it hasn't happened yet.
So, for now, I'm in wait and see mode.

[Statica]

http://www.computerworld.com/hardwar...110420,00.html is a decent review.

[Mac Medic]

I think it's just a temporary stopgap for now. I think Leopard will have virtualization software built in that allows running windows without leaving OS X, just like virtual PC does now, in fact, I think thats why Microsoft has been so wishy washy about whether they will port Virtual PC to the Intel macs, they know Apple is going to do this for themselves. Apple would idealy want their users to use OS X, and they want it to be as easy as possible, they also know some people will want to use Windows occasionally. The problem with BootCamp is that it is very un-apple like. It not an elegant user friendly solution whereas virtualization would be. If you buy hardware now expecting to be able to dual-boot in the future I think you'll be in for a shock. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if it's disabled with Leopard and replaced with virtualization software instead.

--My Powerbook running XP, been doing it for years so maybe this is why I'm not too excited about bootcamp.

[Two|Bit]

I agree with you after listening to the TWiT podcast... thats what they were talking about in it. They said that they were having lots of trouble trying to partition the drives and such... I just want to know if anyone actually has windows running, non virtualized on a mac?

[hobey19]

Originally Posted by Mac Medic If you buy hardware now expecting to be able to dual-boot in the future I think you'll be in for a shock. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if it's disabled with Leopard and replaced with virtualization software instead. --My Powerbook running XP, been doing it for years so maybe this is why I'm not too excited about bootcamp.

according to this article (bottom of the first paragraph) Boot Camp is going to be a feature in Leopard. remember, boot camp is only in beta right now. i think for apple to release boot camp and then go back to a virtualisation-only platform would be bad for business. granted, as you have argued, this may not change sales much, but i know plenty of people are looking forward to running xp on a mini. the company i work for is beginning testing on it next week, because we need a small computer solution, but it has to run xp. the aopen mini clone, since its barebones, is not a good solution for us, because we don't have the manpower to build them. i have seen a couple of places that do sell them pre-assembled, but i have always liked the mini to begin with, and apple has always impressed me w/ lack of noise (except for teh g5 towers, which is understandable).

there was always a pretty good market for minis in the carputer market (which is going to be our main use, only it will be for medical vehicles), but the main problem was lack of software for macs for gps. people would have to run virtualpc to run their gps software. now, with parallels and boot camp being in beta, they have two options, run it virtualised, or run it in xp all the time. i am not saying that the carputer market was the reason apple did this, but just one example where they stand to benefit. lets face it, virtual pc wasn't the most glorious program in the world to be doing virtualisation in

craig

[Mac Medic]

Originally Posted by hobey19 lets face it, virtual pc wasn't the most glorious program in the world to be doing virtualisation in craig

I agree with you on virtual XP, but it is an emulator rather than virtualization software, it had to emulate the x86 instruction set on the fly which is very slow, but with virtualization built into the new intel processors it seems to me that Apple will be able to develop an application that leverages it, takes advantage of the speed and negates users leaving OS X to run 1 or 2 windows apps, basically a much more Apple solution!!. Who really wants to dual boot and maintain 2 OS's? The intention after all would be to encourage those users to use Mac OS and it's applications and not windows. I wouldn't invest any money in Apple hardware right now if your intention is to run windows, I would wait until the new year and see what options are available under Leopard. I'm sure a lot of people would just say that they just won't upgrade to Leopard and will continue with Panther and boot camp. The problem with this is that Apple will just stop releasing updates/patches and software for Panther as they have done in the past for Jaguar and just leave you hanging. for example, itunes 6 requires panther. The more I think about it the more I see that Bootcamp is just a temporary stopgap, and judging by the rumors coming out about Leopard including virtualization software I think I may be right. So don't purchase Apple hardware just yet until Apple make a definite statement on the issue or they'll have a lot of pee'd off switchers.

[hobey19]

Originally Posted by Mac Medic I agree with you on virtual XP, but it is an emulator rather than virtualization software, it had to emulate the x86 instruction set on the fly which is very slow, but with virtualization built into the new intel processors it seems to me that Apple will be able to develop an application that leverages it, takes advantage of the speed and negates users leaving OS X to run 1 or 2 windows apps, basically a much more Apple solution!!.

thanks for clarifying between virtualisation and emulation, i was not aware that there was a difference. i agree to some extent that it would behoove apple to keep from dual-booting in leopard in favor of virtualisation, but i think a lot of people who have begun using boot camp will become accustomed to it. for our needs, it won't matter what happens with leopard (ie boot camp doesn't get carried over to leopard) because xp will be our primary os. for all intents and purposes, we will never even see os x after the initial setup. our customers need xp to run their software, and the mini combines value with power, and now that it 'supports' xp, it fits the bill perfectly. if boot camp doesn't get carried over, we will be one of those people not to upgrade because it won't matter for us.

craig

[Mac Medic]

Don't forget that BootCamp is a time-bombed beta release that will stop working! Which means that to keep it working officially you'll have to upgrade and use whatever is included in Leopard. Apple likes to have control of the entire widget and while I'm sure some enterprising individual will figure out a way to keep bootcamp working it'll end up being a hokey workaround, just like the original XP on Intel Mac hack. Not something to base a corporate purchase on IMHO.

[hobey19]

Originally Posted by Mac Medic Don't forget that BootCamp is a time-bombed beta release that will stop working! Which means that to keep it working officially you'll have to upgrade and use whatever is included in Leopard. Apple likes to have control of the entire widget and while I'm sure some enterprising individual will figure out a way to keep bootcamp working it'll end up being a hokey workaround, just like the original XP on Intel Mac hack. Not something to base a corporate purchase on IMHO.

i agree to a certain extent, but we are basing it on what apple has said as i pointed out in the first article. if we have to virtualize, fine, no biggie, but if there is a way not to, that is what we plan on doing

craig

[Two|Bit]

the best thing to do right now is to wait it out and see what apple does... I wouldn't go out and buy an iMac and a new copy of Windows to try out a beta... just not practical at the moment. If you already of the resources by all means go ahead, but not something to waste 2 grand on

[hobey19]

with the mini, it brings it well under 1k, so it becomes a little more feasible

besides, its not like we are going to be be buying these for a whole fleet of medical vehicles, we are just buying to begin testing. if any of you have ever worked with county/state/[insert govt here] officials you know how long it can take to get things approved. we just want to be on top of things when we do get the approval

craig